ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear
Non ADA Gear => Rack Gear => Topic started by: rabidgerry on June 01, 2022, 01:42:34 PM
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Hello again everyone. Told you I was back.
Right the Behringer FCB1010 is quite literally the best large midi controller pedal around in my opinion once you get some Uno firmware installed.
Anyways I recently just found out it had more functionality than I realised. It has two analogue relays that can operate channels on amp/preamps. There are two jacks for this at the back of the pedal. This is really mega useful. However, for some reason I can only get these switches to change between two of my Peavey Rockmasters channels. I think I know why but do not know how I would go about creating a solution.
So what I think I am going to need to do is create some kind of a custom cable. I was wondering would any of you guys know exactly what I would need to do in order to operate all three channels using the on board FCB1010 relays?
Here is a diagram of the rockmaster foot switch which can normally operate all three channels.
http://snw.lonningdal.no/peavey/rm-tctp/Peavey_Rock_Master_Foot_Switch_Schematic.jpg (http://snw.lonningdal.no/peavey/rm-tctp/Peavey_Rock_Master_Foot_Switch_Schematic.jpg)
So my thinking is, if I was to make a custom cable to work the rockmaster using the behringers relay switches (I believe these jacks are trs) would I need to have some how make a cable that some how excluded the ground and only had the two tip signals?
Also I'm referring to a TRS to Y cable which splits the stereo signal to a separate jack and then plus into each of the relay switches on the Behringer. However I was thinking may be even just a trs to trs type cable plugged into one of the relay jacks might also allow for switching between all three channels on the rockmaster.
Anyone with any advice I would really appreciate it as for the first time in my life I might need a lesser distortion and a to switch back to a heavier distortion. Progress eh :lol:
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Do you have a schematic on how the switch 1 and 2 outputs are wired? Couldn't find anything in the FCB manual
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I'm looking for this information. All I can say for now is they can be switched from momentary to latching. I have them on latching right now. I'll keep digging. Thanks MJMP.
***edit***
Some guy here actually asking about the same thing as me!! But zero info
https://www.harmonycentral.com/forums/topic/1414869-anyone-use-behringer-fcb1010-for-amprelay-switching/ (https://www.harmonycentral.com/forums/topic/1414869-anyone-use-behringer-fcb1010-for-amprelay-switching/)
***edit***
This is also speculation and I shall need to test, but I've read on another forum that
Doesn't the FCB1010 work with two TS cables OR one TRS cable?
I'm pretty sure I read that somewhere.
Too bad I can't find the manual and it doesn't say it on the unit itself (just checked).
I'd check but it would involve spending 5 minutes hooking it up to my Traynor combo (only amp I have with a TRS footswitch input)
But somehow... I could swear that's what I used to do when I was using the Traynor combo live...
and
If I remember correctly, the 2 outputs on the FCB are in fact of the "TRS" variety (you can use a stereo cable and switch two things at once... provided the receiving amp works this way too)
You can use the two jacks separately with a "mono" cable, or use only one with a "stereo" cable.
If I remember correctly...
So I will need to try just a plain old TRS to TRS type cable into one FCB1010 relay switch to see what functionality I am getting.
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So if they are TRS you have 2 switches on switch 1 and on switch 2. But they switch in and out at the same time?
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So if they are TRS you have 2 switches on switch 1 and on switch 2. But they switch in and out at the same time?
No sure I understand you. You mean both FCB1010 switches operate at the same time? No they are operated independently.
Initially how I tried to use these relays where by running a TRS - Y cable from the rockmaster to the FCB1010.
The TRS end would plug into the Peavey and then the two mono jack I was plugging into each of the switches on the FCB1010.
The functionality I was getting was pretty random. I could never ever reach all three of the channels. Two at best if I recall.
But after reading that info above I'm starting to wonder would a trs - trs cable into one FCB1010 switch allow me to reach all three channels albeit via one footswitch?
Which might not actually be suitable. But then perhaps a custom cable could allow me to switch back using the other fcb1010 switch. I dunno, it's a bit confusing.
Skip to 31 mins in, does this shed any light on the functionality?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYNND5nMWhc
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Let me try to explain what I mean, switch 1 has a TRS jack, so I asume it has 2 contacts. So if you set switch 1 to on both contacts will switch at the same time.
Now you can measure this, plug in a stereo jack into switch 1 and take a meter set to ohms, measure between sleeve and ring and sleeve and tip, if switch 1 is off you should have no continuity, if switch 1 is on you should have continuity on both.
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Hey RG, interesting video. So Y cable (TRS to 2 x TS) is the go, TRS at the rockmaster and Tip to switch 1 and Ring to switch 2 (or vis versa). This emulates the 2 switches on the peavey pedal and turning them on/off on the FCB will be the same as pressing them on/off on the peavey pedal. The peavey pedal has 4 states:
Tip off Ring off = FCB 1 off, 2 off = Bypass?? (I'm just guessing what the rockmaster state equates to here based on your peavey FS diagram)
Tip on Ring off = FCB 1 on, 2 off = Clean??
Tip off Ring on = FCB 1 off, 2 on = Ultra??
Tip on Ring on = FCB 1 on, 2 on = Ultra/Crunch??
So since you can assign multiple things to each patch, you can include a different switch state in that patch e.g. Tip on (FCB 1 on, 2 off) etc. So when you change patch it will select the rockmaster mode/state as part of the patch. I'm assuming this is how you want to use it? Alternatively you can program the FCB up/down buttons to toggle the FCB switches. I can't see that you would want to use momentary switching (which the FCB can be programmed to do) unless you want to press a FCB button to change the rockmaster to a different state and hold it, releasing reverts to off again. So latching (which is default) makes more sense.
Using a TRS at the FCB end doesn't do anything practical, the FCB switches just toggle the tip hi/low, on/off and if you had a TRS plugged into it, it "probably" toggles both the tip and the ring :dunno: at the same time (guessing here) which would/may cause strange results at the rockmaster end.
When you include the FCB switching in a patch, you need to include both FCB switches and set them to either on or off to ensure you select the right state on the rockmaster. This may be why you have been getting strange results?
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Unfortunately everything is on hold whilst I get over Covid. I tested positive yesterday. Feel terrible. But when I am able I will get testing to see what is going on.
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Hey RG, bummer :facepalm: , hope you get better soon. The FCB can be a bit of a head f**k but I think I've worked it out for you.
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So currently I had the switches both 1 and 2 set to "on" for every patch on FCB. So by your reckoning you think I need to have one of the switches set to "off"?
I have copied the original midi editor file for FCB1010 which corresponds to my GX700 and made a new version what now has SW1 set to On and SW2 set to Off.
No need for a TRS to TRS cable then.
Ok will test once I'm well enough.
Thank you guys.
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I have all my patches set up the same so I have the switches set to 1 on and 2 off across all the patches that I am using so forget about that aspect. I just needed to know if the 1 on and 2 off will work as I want it to i.e allow me to switch between all channels. Of course depending on which does which I would always want to be on the Ultra as default and then drop to the crunch occasionally and may one day when I'm old and grey to the clean :lol:.
Yes I have assigned two foot switches to operate each relay switch, again set up the same for all program changes/patches.
I'm using an Uno firmware so the top row of FCB footswitches I have designated for changing patches only on the GX-700. the bottom row have assigned for "stomp box" mode. However as the Gx-700 only has a certain amount of things you can assign via midi I had a few spare foot switches left on the FCB, so I decided to use those to operate the peavey rockmaster channels.
So basically forget about the overall setup of the FCB. This is sorted. I just need to figure out how to program the to foot switches I had saved for operating the two relays.
As I mentioned before I didn't know what the hell I was doing so I just set them to both "on" using the FCB1010 editing software. This means whatever patch I was switching to I had the switches activated on every patch (both switch lights on on the FCB) as I just figured I need to turn these on to make the operable.
See attached screen shot. The two foot switches labelled "delay" are those I left for switching the relays. This will show you one patch example. Never worry about how it is set up on other patches I just have them the same on all patches. What I would like to know if if the way the relay switches are set here is the correct way to get channel changing on the Peavey.
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Hey RG, so just watched the video again, she's using standard firmware, on first look, I thought she said you have to assign one pedal off and one on and then include them in you patch etc. But you just have to assign on or off to the patch for each switch as you have done. So you've assigned 1 on and 2 off for each patch so when you change to each patch it will tell the rockmaster to go to Tip on Ring off = FCB 1 on, 2 off = Clean?? not sure what rockmaster mode this is, same as pressing the bypass/clean button on (led on) and the Ultra/Ultracrunch off (no led). So obviously one way to change the rockmaster is have a patch for each rockmaster mode, just set switch 1 and 2 to what you want to mimic the peavey switch.
If the stomp box setting lets you toggle the switches then you should be able to use them to switch the rockmaster, and when you change patch it will change to the setting in the patch. So in the video, she does this by assigning the bank up/down buttons to toggle the switches, if you can do this to the delay buttons in stomp box mode (is this mode available in the factory firmware?) it should work and be just like the buttons on the peavey pedal.
(As I mentioned before I didn't know what the hell I was doing so I just set them to both "on" using the FCB1010 editing software. This means whatever patch I was switching to I had the switches activated on every patch (both switch lights on on the FCB) as I just figured I need to turn these on to make the operable.) They will be operable if on or off, they just open or close the tip and ring contacts in the rockmaster FS jack. Just select the switch settings (on or off) you want in the patch that sets the rockmaster to what you want.
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Well that's just it, I can get those foot switches (delay, delay) to manipulate the rockmaster channels ok, but just not as I would like. But then as mentioned, I had them set to both "On". So may be this is all it was then? I need to have one set to "on" and one set to "off"? We shall see once I am able to test.
My train of thought was because I am able to switch between crunch and ultra I needed some kind of custom cable.
No the stomp box mode is not available with the factory firmware.
Oh and I have no clue what bypass mode is all about? I'm ignoring that detail as there are three channels and that's all we need to know I think. Have no idea about a bypass mode which isn't mentioned in the manual.
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Yeh the manual just talks about switching between 3 modes and isn't particularly helpful. My thought is bypass mode bypasses the Ultra - Ultra/Crunch switch (Sw2) so you can have just clean. Otherwise, since Sw2 toggles between Ultra and Ultra/Crunch one of those 2 settings is always selected (on is one and off is the other) you'd have to bypass them just to have clean on it's own. Clean probably is always on regardless of Sw1 setting and pressing Sw1 brings in Sw2 (whatever it's set to at the time)
Maybe:
Sw1 Sw2
Off Off = Clean and Sw2 bypassed
Off On = Clean and Sw2 bypassed
On Off = Clean + Ultra?
On On = Clean + Ultra/crunch?
So Sw1 has to be On to get Ultra and Crunch. So with the patch (unless you want clean) you need Sw1 On and Sw 2 On or Off depending if you want Ultra or Ultra/Crunch.
Anyway you'll soon hear whats going on by changing the delay delay buttons. The only cable you need is the insert/Y cable use Tip lead in Sw1 and Ring lead in Sw2.
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So I have a foot switch for my Rockmaster at home. The switch has two buttons.
Button 1 switches between crunch and ultra channels
Button 2 changes over to clean. While on clean pressing the button 1 doesn't take you back to the ultra/crunch channels it merely switches between the 2 channels in the back ground. The only way to get back to those channels to to press button 2 again.
Does this add any light to things?
I'll try and document this when I'm next able
Maybe:
Sw1 Sw2
Off Off = Clean and Sw2 bypassed
Off On = Clean and Sw2 bypassed
On Off = Clean + Ultra?
On On = Clean + Ultra/crunch?
Since I have set all the patches to SW1 On and SW2 Off to begin with we shall see what channel this actually takes us to first.
The UNo firmware also allows for inverting the switch functionality. But things are confusing for me as it is so I won't mess with that.
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I guess you can set those FCB switches to momentary or latching too? How are they set?
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So that confirms what I was thinking/saying. But I've been calling the peavey FS crunch to ultra button/switch = Sw2 (not 1) and the clean bypass button/switch = Sw1 as this lines up with the wiring diagram. Tip changes clean bypass and ring changes Crunch Ultra. It doesn't mater as long as you plug the right TS plug into the correct FCB jacks to get what you have programmed to work.
So with FCB Sw1 = on and FCB Sw2 = off (as you have programmed it) AND Tip mono TS lead (so tip to tip) in FCB Sw1 socket and Ring mono TS lead (so ring to tip) in FCB Sw2 socket, it should select either crunch or Ultra when you select the patch and whatever stomp button you have set to toggle FCB Sw2 will toggle between Ultra and Crunch. Pressing FCB Sw1 stomp button (turns Sw1 off) to select clean (and bypass crunch ultra) just like the peavey FS
If when you try it, changing patch initially selects clean and not crunch/ultra, then you just need to reverse the sw1 and 2 on off settings I've listed.
@MJMP, set to latching. Where momentary might be useful is playing a song in either Crunch or Ultra mode and you just want clean for a few notes/barres, if the clean switch was set to momentary, you could press it to change to clean then release to go back...
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I guess you can set those FCB switches to momentary or latching too? How are they set?
Yes I have them programmed for latching but yes you can have momentary should you wish.
So that confirms what I was thinking/saying. But I've been calling the peavey FS crunch to ultra button/switch = Sw2 (not 1) and the clean bypass button/switch = Sw1 as this lines up with the wiring diagram. Tip changes clean bypass and ring changes Crunch Ultra. It doesn't mater as long as you plug the right TS plug into the correct FCB jacks to get what you have programmed to work.
So with FCB Sw1 = on and FCB Sw2 = off (as you have programmed it) AND Tip mono TS lead (so tip to tip) in FCB Sw1 socket and Ring mono TS lead (so ring to tip) in FCB Sw2 socket, it should select either crunch or Ultra when you select the patch and whatever stomp button you have set to toggle FCB Sw2 will toggle between Ultra and Crunch. Pressing FCB Sw1 stomp button (turns Sw1 off) to select clean (and bypass crunch ultra) just like the peavey FS
If when you try it, changing patch initially selects clean and not crunch/ultra, then you just need to reverse the sw1 and 2 on off settings I've listed.
@MJMP, set to latching. Where momentary might be useful is playing a song in either Crunch or Ultra mode and you just want clean for a few notes/barres, if the clean switch was set to momentary, you could press it to change to clean then release to go back...
Ok well I still haven't been allowed out until I tested negative from covid so that has only happened today. I can test once I get into the rehearsal room again.
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Hey RG, how's your health? hopefully COVID didn't knock you around too much? :wave:
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I'm fine now Richard. The worst was in the first 4 days after testing positive. Then basically spent the next week with sniffles a bit of a cough. Fine now though, thanks for asking :thumb-up:
Right so I didn't actually get to re-program the fcb1010. But I did switch the pedals about and even with one on and one off nothing happened. However if I pulled the switch 1 cable out half way I was able to switch between two of the channels. I can't remember now which ones. I think I got Ultra and Crunch. With this pulled half way out on switch 1 switch 2 did nothing. Then if I pulled switch 2 jack half way out I was able to get clean, but I couldn't switch back to the gain channels unless that jack got pushed all the way in again. Weird!!! Still convinced I need to make some sort of a custom cable. But then I dunno :dunno:
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Glad you're feeling better :whoohoo!: .
Well that is weird. The FCB jacks can take a mono or stereo plug though not sure how they are wired inside. It should work if your lead is wired correctly (check it in case?)
It should be:
RM Sw1 Sw2
Tip > Tip
Ring > Tip
S > S S
When you pull the jack half out it will join the Tip and Ring inside the FCB jack So not sure whats going on there that makes it sort of work. If the lead is wired correctly, it should work, see attached circuit diagram of the FS, it's quite simple.
Remember though when you select a patch you have set the Sw1 and Sw2 settings in the patch so this is where it should start at before you start toggling the FCB stomp buttons.
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The cable I'm using is fine, it's a trs to two ts ends cable, so I stereo y cable I guess. I have used it with a different foot switch (behringer ) to control the rockmaster channels easily.
ere is a video where I had one patch saved with switch 2 on. Then played about with switches 3 and 4 to control turning the relays 1 and 2 of and on but as you can see it's not working right. I got clean and ultra channels this time and no crunch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWC20QKb7gU?feature=share
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Ok so when you have FCB3 on it selects clean (and it shouldn't matter what FCB4 is on or off) when you first pressed 3, 4 was off. When you turn 3 off it goes back to (or should do) whatever 4 is set to, seems off is Ultra and on is Crunch. You didn't toggle 4 while 3 is off (only when 3 was on). 3 has to be off for 4 to work and it (4) should switch between Ultra and Crunch but only when 3 is off. Turning 4 on/off (as you were doing) will not do anything if 3 is on (which selects clean and bypasses the other switch (4) setting).
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I hope you are right. Why my simple mind can't work any of this out :facepalm:
Ok so at no stage in that video did I I have 3 (switch 1) off and 4 (switch 2) on. Right I shall try this.
Now if this works they way it is currently programmed will be a little bit of a pain in the ass.
The extra measures I need to take are to make sure I turn off switch 1 when I activate switch 2 via pedal 4. And then do the same for pedal 3 and have that turn off switch 2. Currently I have both pedals programmed to turn on switch 1 and switch 2 respectfully but when each is pressed it will not interfere with the other switch. This can be changed though so I'll give this a go.
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So a couple of more thoughts. First swap the 2 ts leads over so 1 is 2 and 2 is one. Then FCB 3 and 4 will look the same as the peavey foot switch, i.e. clean/bypass on the right ultra/crunch on the left (you don't have to but maybe it will help you remember which is which better?). When you select patch 7, it switches sw2 on, so sw2 must be ultra/crunch (and you hear that) and this worked (only) because sw1 was off in patch 7.
So you selected 7 and had ultra but the leds on 3 & 4 didn't turn on (4 should have been on if it was latched/active), I think they don't start to work properly until first press like CC pedal latching.
When you first pressed 3, the light came on but it didn't change to clean the first time seems it was silence until you pressed 7 again, but now that switch is active? Latched?
You then pressed 3 off then on again and got clean, you then toggle 4 on/off and no change (because clean is selected (3 is on)). By now if you had switched 3 off, 4 would toggle between ultra and crunch and, if 3 and 4 need to be latched, they would both have been because you pressed them a few times.
I suspect if you change patch 7 to be off off (instead of now off on) it will select crunch (assuming sw 2 on = ultra). If you change patch 7 to be on off or on on it will select clean.
Maybe just program a few patches with the switches set to pick the rockmaster mode you want:
sw1 sw2
off off = crunch
off on = Ultra
on off = clean
on on = clean
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So not quite sure what is going on here but I'm still convinced a custom cable has to be made for this although I hope I am wrong.
Ok so changed the FCB to turn off the SW1 when I hit SW2 although now I am thinking it would be best to perhaps leave this as only turning SW2 on and off and not have any affect on SW1. The results I got where the same as before. However if I unplugged the jack from SW1 I was actually able to switch via pedal 4 turning SW2 on and off between Ultra and Crunch channels. Plugging a jack from the cable back into SW1 put the clean channel back on again. Pretty confusing.
Not really sure what else to try. One thing is for sure though, I can access the channels via the SW's albeit in a round about and non use friendly way.
More experimenting is required.
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That is confusing. The Sw1 jack removed should be the same as turning it off with FCB3. To toggle between Ultra and Crunch Sw1 has to be off. If Sw1 is on (Clean) then Sw2 shouldn't make any difference. If a custom cable is required, I'm not sure what it would need to be :dunno: . The only thing I can think of given your result by removing Sw1 jack is it has something to do with the FCB jacks accepting TS or TRS plugs. I've mulled that over and can't work out why or how to manipulate that correctly or if it should make any difference particularly when Sw2 toggles Ultra and Crunch by switching on and off as it should. So then why does Sw1 not toggle Clean and bypass (bypass = Sw2 will work now, Clean = Sw2 wont work (do anything)) and you have to pull the jack to make it go Off and select bypass activating Sw2 changes.
It may be worth trying my other suggestion by making 3 different patches with the various switch combinations set in them to select the different modes:
Sw1 Sw2
Off Off = Ultra
Off On = Crunch
On Off or On =Clean
If this doesn't work then reverse Sw1 and Sw2 settings in the patches and it should. Maybe that's the issue and all the setting are upside down?
e.g.
Sw1 Sw2
On On = Ultra
On Off = Crunch
Off On or Off = Clean
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Another thought I had which relates back to what I was thinking in previous posts re CC latching and possibly why it's a bit confusing.
When you change to a patch that has the Sw1 and Sw2 settings programmed, they take precedence over the Sw1 & 2 settings regardless of what FCB 3 and 4 are set to (but the FCB switch leds don't change to reflect the settings in the patch (i.e. select P7 Sw1 off and Sw2 on, the FCB4 led should be on but in the video, it isn't thus it's not latched yet and P7 settings take precedence). In the video, you had to toggle FCB 3 on and off the on again to select Clean. With CC latching, typically you need to select the state for it to then take over from the programmed or default state.
So when you selected patch 7, that set Sw1 off (bypass) and Sw 2 on (Ultra). If patch 7 had Sw1 on it should select Clean (regardless of Sw2 setting in the patch (try this to see if I'm right)).
So after changing to patch 7, you had to turn FCB 3 (Sw1) on then off (now the off should latch as it is the same as the patch, so even though Sw1 was off (FCB3 off) when the patch was selected, it hadn't latched yet and you had to switch it on then off again for it to latch and now take control from the initial patch setting.
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I think this might also be a little puzzling for you Richard as you might not be aware that by pressing each Pedal you can also get it to affect the other switch. So I hadn't given much thought to these really but I now know in order for it to work properly, I need to have Pedal 3 programmed in such away that when I activate it, it will not affect Pedal 4.
This would mean then if I have all presets programmed to have only SW2 from scratch that when I hit pedal 3 I will then end up with SW1 and SW2 on which is a combo that means we will get clean.
Then in order to get the distortion channels I press Pedal 3 again to turn off SW1 and again have no affect on SW2 and as that was already on then we will be left with Ultra.
So in order for Pedal 4 to work properly also it needs to be switched to only affect SW2 and not have any affect on SW1. This way then I can switch between Crunch and Ultra.
So where I think things where going wrong before was I had Pedal 4 programmed to turn off SW1 when I pressed it, which mean I was getting SW1 ON and SW2 OFF at one press and SW2 ON and SW1 OFF at another press and that basically meant I got clean and Ultra only.
So by taking away Pedal 4's SW1 OFF instruction you can flick through the channels if you use Pedal 3 to basically change to clean and use Pedal 4 to go between Crunch and Ultra.
Pedal 3 = Clean/Distorted
Pedal 4 = Crunch/Ultra (but only is Pedal 3 has turned off SW1).
No I have not put this into practice yet as it had only dawned on me when I had left the practice room, but I figured it out when I got home and thought why does one cable in SW2 work Crunch and Ultra but when I plug in the cable into SW1 as well I got back to clean and then looked at how I had it programmed. So I have to make Pedal 3 and 4 only operate each respective SW.
Also to refer to your thoughts on patches taking precedence, well I have the patches programmed in a way that they have no affect on any of the stomp box Pedal 1-4 but also will turn off Pedal 5 if say I stomp on them. This is because I use Pedal 5 as my Solo pedal and in that it turns on Volume boost and Detune. So technically if Pedals 3 and 4 are on this should have not change if I press the patch pedal again. However this is negated by the simple fact that I have programmed in each patch pedal to always turn SW2 on and SW1 off so I will always be on Ultra to start with.
See below on Preset/pedal 7 SW2 will be on when I press that pedal and SW1 off
Then Pedal 3 has SW2 greyed out meaning no affect and Pedal 4 has SW1 greyed out meaning the same.
(https://i.ibb.co/Rbb5sbg/fcb1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xLL4BL2)
(https://i.ibb.co/WWN65qJ/fcb2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MDysSW0)
(https://i.ibb.co/ysDkbsL/fcb3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mzmyMzQ)
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http://snw.lonningdal.no/peavey/rm-tctp/
Check this out, a lot of info on the rockmaster including a schematic of the footswitch.
http://snw.lonningdal.no/peavey/rm-tctp/Peavey_Rock_Master_Foot_Switch_Schematic.jpg
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Well that explains why it was being strange. I was working from the perspective that Sw3 and 4 only operated on their respective jacks.
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You're right, they do, but I think only with the UNO firmware you are actually able to manipulate the other.
Now when I first started messing with this I didn't really pay much attention to how I had the extra switching capability set, but then when I started to think perhaps I need it set to have one switch turn the other off whilst turning one on it dawned on me that I actually need each to not affect the other at all! So lets see if this works when I put it into practice.
This should allow for the following combos:
SW1 ON SW2 ON - Clean
SW1 off SW2 ON - Ultra
SW1 off SW2 off - Crunch
SW1 ON SW2 off - Clean
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Like I said before, and now you've got each Sw just doing what it's supposed to, when Sw1 is on it makes no difference what Sw2 is set to. In the end though, wouldn't it be easier just to program the Sw settings you want into a patch for each sound?
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Well that kind of patch setup doesn't suit me so I would not do this unless I was desperate. I'm only needing to go between Crunch and Ultra right now anyway so clean was simply to have all options available to me at the tap of a foot. Which they are if I use a Behringer AB200.
Anyways just an update. So it doesn't matter about the setup of the SW1 and SW2 the way I was expecting, it still didn't work. As soon as a plug a jack from the Y cable into SW1 and a jack into SW2 I get clean and Ultra only. If I take out SW1 jack and leave only SW2 with a jack I get ultra and crunch switchable via SW2 assigned pedal 4. Really don't understand why this is but at least I can access the two channels that I actually need.
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Does this help shed any light on things? I managed to get the way the FCB1010 relay switches work from the FCB1010 user group. Just wondering if there might be something in this document that be the answer to this inability to access all three channels.
Yes yes I haven't given up :lol:
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Hey RG, interesting about the stereo cable into Sw 1. But I thought you had this solved by making sure the 2 switches just do one thing (rather than affect each other or be affected by anything else in any way). All my initial suggestions for how it works are correct as long as each Sw just does one thing i.e. make or break the tip connection on a mono lead. This should replicate what the Peavey foot switch does when using a TRS > TS/TS insert lead and the 2 FCB switches will act the same as the 2 Peavey foot switch switches, giving you the same functionality.
Can the FCB Sw1 stereo plug help? I don't think so for what you want as Sw1 would need to be able to toggle all 4 states, well you actually need 3 states as when Sw1 is On you get Clean regardless of Sw2's setting. When Sw1 is off, then (and only then), Sw2 toggles between Crunch and Ultra.
However, it does seem possible that a TRS <> TRS lead could be used into FCB Sw1 but you would need to program 2 of the FCB buttons, one to toggle the tip (relay 1) and one to toggle the ring (relay 2)
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No mate, I had not cracked this. I was getting use via one end of a Y cable plugged into SW2 and able to cycle between crunch and ultra which for me at this time is fine. I still had not been able to get clean. I did try a TRS cable also but I didn't realise the other pedal would still work. So basically I was trying to use one pedal to cycle through whilst using the TRS cable. I never thought that both pedals would still work, for that I thought I would need both SW inputs with a cable a jack inserted.
And yes I have each switch assigned to pedal 3 and 4 and they are programmed to not affect one another. So basically each pedal only control each switch.
Well I'm going to try the regular TRS to TRS cable today and just use SW1 input. According to the FCB group guy who offered this info to me, he says according to that diagram for the FCB switches, plugging into one SW input should work. My argument with this was but only one pedal will work. But apparently a stereo cable into SW1 means both relays still work and can be switched using the two pedals I have assigned to control them. We shall see.
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Hey RG, the FCB group guy is right, a TRS <> TRS should work but "only" if plugged into Sw1 (Sw2 isn't wired the same). The ring of Sw1 is connected to the tip of Sw2 "if" nothing is plugged into Sw2 "and" a TRS plug is in Sw1. But you still have to assign a FCB button to each Sw (relay) as each button can only toggle on/off. This is the same as using a TRS > TS/RS (insert) cable and plugging each mono plug into either Sw1 or Sw2.
A "Y" cable and an"insert lead" are not the same thing (sorry if you know this already). A Y cable joins 3 mono jacks together so you can split one signal into 2 (or vis versa):
T1____T2
|
-----T3
S1____S2
|
-----S3
An insert lead connects the tip of a stereo plug to the tip of a mono plug and the ring to the tip of another mono plug
T1______T2
R1______T3
S1______S2
|
------S3
If you look at the FCB diagram (doc) you attached, the Ring of Sw1 either connects no where (mono plug) or connects to Sw2 Tip (stereo plug). However, if you have a plug in Sw2 it breaks the connection between Sw1 ring and Sw2 Tip.
So a TRS <> TRS cable plugged into Sw1 (and nothing in Sw2) AND 2 buttons assigned, one to Sw1 (relay1) and one to Sw2 (relay2) you can use just the one stereo cable and the 2 buttons should work the same way the Peavey FS works.
If you use an insert lead TRS <> TS/RS and plug each mono plug into either Sw1 and Sw2, the mono plug connected to the TRS Tip will toggle clean on/off and the mono plug connected to the TRS Ring will toggle Ultra/Crunch. However, if Clean is toggled On, Ultra/Crunch is bypassed so that the Ultra/Crunch Sw will do nothing until Clean is turned Off.
Now you could get cleaver/complicated (warning this may do your head in LoL) and assign 3 FCB buttons to the FCB Sws' (relays) so each button will select a specific voice rather than toggle. So say you use Btn3 = Clean, Btn4 = Crunch and Btn5 = Ultra. To make this work you need to have each Btn do a couple of things when selected (turned on) including turning On/Off the other Btns:
Btn3 On = Sw1 On (will select clean regardless of Sw2 setting)
Btn4 On = Sw1 Off and Sw2 Off (will select Crunch)
Btn5 On = Sw1 Off and Sw2 On (will select Ultra)
So to do this (I'm assuming this is possible with you UNO SW):
Btn3 On - assign to Sw1 normal On/Off When selected, Btn4 & 5's On/Off state shouldn't matter, it will select Clean. However, if you turn Btn3 Off, then Btn4 & 5 state does matter as what they (i.e. Sw2) are currently set to will be selected by turning Btn3 Off. So if you make Btn3 On also turn Btn4 Off and Btn 5 ON, turning Off Btn3 should revert to Ultra (because Btn4 Off = Sw2 On (using reverse ON/Off for Btn4)). If you prefer to revert to Crunch then make Btn3 On turn Btn4 On and Btn5 Off.
Btn4 On - assign to Sw2 Off (use the reverse Btn On/Off feature maybe to do this?) and ALSO turn Btn3 Off and you may need to/should also turn Btn5 Off
Btn5 On - assign to Sw2 On and Also turn Btn3 Off and Btn4 Off
Anyway after writing this I suspect this may possibly make your head spin.
But hope it helps and you get it to work. :wave:
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Hey RG, the FCB group guy is right, a TRS <> TRS should work but "only" if plugged into Sw1 (Sw2 isn't wired the same). The ring of Sw1 is connected to the tip of Sw2 "if" nothing is plugged into Sw2 "and" a TRS plug is in Sw1. But you still have to assign a FCB button to each Sw (relay) as each button can only toggle on/off. This is the same as using a TRS > TS/RS (insert) cable and plugging each mono plug into either Sw1 or Sw2.
A "Y" cable and an"insert lead" are not the same thing (sorry if you know this already). A Y cable joins 3 mono jacks together so you can split one signal into 2 (or vis versa):
T1____T2
|
-----T3
S1____S2
|
-----S3
An insert lead connects the tip of a stereo plug to the tip of a mono plug and the ring to the tip of another mono plug
T1______T2
R1______T3
S1______S2
|
------S3
If you look at the FCB diagram (doc) you attached, the Ring of Sw1 either connects no where (mono plug) or connects to Sw2 Tip (stereo plug). However, if you have a plug in Sw2 it breaks the connection between Sw1 ring and Sw2 Tip.
So a TRS <> TRS cable plugged into Sw1 (and nothing in Sw2) AND 2 buttons assigned, one to Sw1 (relay1) and one to Sw2 (relay2) you can use just the one stereo cable and the 2 buttons should work the same way the Peavey FS works.
If you use an insert lead TRS <> TS/RS and plug each mono plug into either Sw1 and Sw2, the mono plug connected to the TRS Tip will toggle clean on/off and the mono plug connected to the TRS Ring will toggle Ultra/Crunch. However, if Clean is toggled On, Ultra/Crunch is bypassed so that the Ultra/Crunch Sw will do nothing until Clean is turned Off.
Now you could get cleaver/complicated (warning this may do your head in LoL) and assign 3 FCB buttons to the FCB Sws' (relays) so each button will select a specific voice rather than toggle. So say you use Btn3 = Clean, Btn4 = Crunch and Btn5 = Ultra. To make this work you need to have each Btn do a couple of things when selected (turned on) including turning On/Off the other Btns:
Btn3 On = Sw1 On (will select clean regardless of Sw2 setting)
Btn4 On = Sw1 Off and Sw2 Off (will select Crunch)
Btn5 On = Sw1 Off and Sw2 On (will select Ultra)
So to do this (I'm assuming this is possible with you UNO SW):
Btn3 On - assign to Sw1 normal On/Off When selected, Btn4 & 5's On/Off state shouldn't matter, it will select Clean. However, if you turn Btn3 Off, then Btn4 & 5 state does matter as what they (i.e. Sw2) are currently set to will be selected by turning Btn3 Off. So if you make Btn3 On also turn Btn4 Off and Btn 5 ON, turning Off Btn3 should revert to Ultra (because Btn4 Off = Sw2 On (using reverse ON/Off for Btn4)). If you prefer to revert to Crunch then make Btn3 On turn Btn4 On and Btn5 Off.
Btn4 On - assign to Sw2 Off (use the reverse Btn On/Off feature maybe to do this?) and ALSO turn Btn3 Off and you may need to/should also turn Btn5 Off
Btn5 On - assign to Sw2 On and Also turn Btn3 Off and Btn4 Off
Anyway after writing this I suspect this may possibly make your head spin.
But hope it helps and you get it to work. :wave:
Well I got to the practice room yesterday and the first thing I did was take a TRS - TRS cable I have for using the rockmaster at home (have a footswitch that does the same job as a peavey footswitch at home you see) and plug it into SW1 of the FCB1010.
I then ran the TRS cable to the peavey rockmaster preamp. I pressed pedal 3 and got clean! I pressed it again and got ultra. I then pressed pedal 4 and was able to switch between ultra and crunch!
IT HAS FINALLY BEEN CRACKED!
I believe I was close to this in the past however I never plugged the TRS cable into SW1. I only tried SW2, reason being I didn't think it would matter as I figured they would be both the same. Anyways it works! It made my day actually. But I ran into a few problems later as I was trying to go between patches for different songs and having the patch pedals change the channel back to clean on me.
So I knew what this was but as I didn't have the laptop with me I didn't think I would be able to rectify the problem there on the day. But come the final run of the songs I asked the guys to wait and took a bit of time to follow the uno manual that I was able to download on the fly. Selected the pre-set I wanted to edit, held down pedal for 2.5secs entered into the editing mode, tapped pedal 1 which popped a '0' in the display. Then pressed up up to confirm that was what I wanted to edit. Then pressed pedal 1 again and this moved the value in the display to '1'. Then pressed up again to confirm. Held down for 2.5secs and exited the edit mode.
Hey presto! The patch then would always begin with both SW1 and SW2 leds illuminated meaning I was on Ultra channel. I then did this for the rest of the patches (pedal 6-10 as I have 1-5 as stompboxes) because I would generally start on Ultra and then if I need to I can switch to Crunch or Clean.
So the saga is over! I believe I'm exploiting a far more functionality now of the FCB1010 and I love the feeling I'm fully in control of everything I need at the moment. I can't recommend the pedal enough with that custom Uno firmware. It really is fantastic.
As for your extra suggestions Richard. I believe that actually would be possible. You might even say they was I'm switching the channels is programmed quite basic. But you could actually get really clever depending on your needs. For me though I have pedal 5 programmed for a volume boost/detune for solos so that pedal is already required for another job. That was also part of the reason I liked the idea of using 3 and 4 for the peavey channels as they were not being used. Pedals 1 and 2 are programmed to turn other effect modules on/off depending on the patch.
Thanks for all the help with this, it's much appreciated my man :thumb-up:. Hopefully someone else on the internet find it useful at some point in time.
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Ah finally your quest is done :thumb-up:
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yes finally :lol:
Just in the nick of time too! As I'm beginning rehearsing a song with a cleanish intro next week.
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Hey RG, fantastic :whoohoo!: .