MP-1 Phantom Power

[Harley Hexxe]

Oh yes, you definitely want a MIDI controller for the preamp, unless you're in a studio, then it doesn't matter. That goes for any ADA preamp.

With the MP-1 and the Classic, the programming is relatively simple. For these, you just have your program change to whichever sound patch you've created, and as for effects, you can do that two ways.

If you have single effects units such as the S-1000, 128i, or similar, you can set these effects and insert them in the effects loop of the MP-1. Within each program change, you have the option to have the loop in or out, the same way you do with the chorus. You can have one patch with the effects loop out to bypass the effect, (which will always be on), and one patch with the effects loop in to add the effect to your tone.

The other way is to always have the effects loop in, and have an external way to bypass the effect(s) in the loop. The big rack Richard is referring to has multiple ADA effects that are from the early to mid-80s. These are all pre-MIDI and most are set to one effect, albeit delay. chorus, flange, etc. I can bring these in and out of the signal path using my Ground Control MIDI pedal with a couple of GCX loop switchers. So, for this setup, the loops in the MP-1s will always be in. The Ground Control is also phantom powered via the GCX which is pretty handy. Otherwise, I'd have a  MC-1 or MPC with a MIDI cable, and a dozen FS-2 foot switches mounted on a pedal board the size of a surfboard, and a dozen or so TRS cables running to the rack. Not very practical.

The Ground Control also lets me use multi-effects units with these older rack effects as it can control up to eight individual MIDI units on different MIDI channels at the same time. This is why I never spent a lot of time MIDI mapping, although I did do that before I bought the Ground Control.

The point I'm making here is you have options. You're not limited to what the last owner of the MP-1 had. It depends on how you want to set up your rig for live gigs.

I'm thinking for now, I'll just hook up the MP-1 and power amp to my pedalboard, and essentially use it as a regular amp head, except in stereo. Down the road though, I'll probably build a proper rack rig, I'm considering using the MLC Dual Stereo Line Mixer MkII for running effects in series/parallel. Most of the effects I want to use for that are MIDI controllable so I'm thinking it should be moderately easy. But then again I know very little about building rack rigs haha

Hey Chase2147,
If I'm using MIDI multi-effects units, then I just leave the loop in all the time as I stated in my previous post. I always have a bypass preset in everything MIDI that I own, including the preamps. Usually, the last program patch is the one I set up for a bypass, (127, or 128, depending on the device). I've done it this way because in my large rack I have my MP-1, 3TM, and MP-2 in it. The reason for this method of bypassing the preamps I don't want to hear is because I found out after I purchased the GCX units, the way they switch things out of the signal path causes a ground issue with the ADAs, and so I took them out of the switch loops. It doesn't do this with effects, just the preamps. Some of the MIDI units I have also have a bypass built-in, such as the Lexicon MPX-1. For something like that, I just set it in bypass mode, and save it that way as a preset.
I forgot to mention, I also use a Rane SM-26 Splitter/Mixer to put the preamps into the audio signal path.

I can run my MIDI effects audio signal through the loops if I want to, but that's a lot more cabling and if you start building a rack, you'll figure that out fast. Even the non-MIDI effects aren't actually sending an audio signal through the GCX loops. I made custom cables to use in those loops to bypass or engage the effects by way of the footswitch jacks on the back of the units. The audio signal again is short patch cables that daisy-chain the effects in the preamp loop. That's for a simple stereo rig.
 
For a more complex rig for me, if I want to run some effects in parallel, I use a 2nd SM-26, and create three stereo channels, and route the effects I want in parallel to one of the other stereo paths, then blend it back in at the end of the effects chain. Nowadays, I think most multi-effects come with all that built into the units. The MPX-1 does, but the LXP-15II doesn't do that.

Anyway, if you have a way to bypass your effects via MIDI, then that would be the best way to do it. The less cables you run, the less chances for signal path issues you'll have.

[Chase42147]

Hey Chase42147, so yes I control the multi Fx via midi and no, when I used a MP-1 I never used the loop. And when I switched to MP-2 (as soon as they came out here in Oz) I just swapped it for the MP-1 and didn't use its loops either.
So in that rack rig (8RU SKB rack) I have a small 8 ch Yamaha mixer (AM802) which has 3 Fx sends velcro'd to the bottom of the rack.  Initially MP-1 (now MP-2) at the top, followed by Alesis Quadverb (the original one) then Digitech IPS33 Smart Shift (harmoniser) and ADA B200s power amp (now swapped for a Carvin DCM200L).
So I always ran it like a PA.  MP-1 or MP2 > ch 1 & 2, IPS33 A & B outs > ch 3 & 4, QV outs L & R > ch 5 & 6.  Mixer outs L/R into power amp > stereo wired Yamaha Quadbox (which I put some cardboard down the middle of to help separation).  Mixer sends 1 & 2 > QV inputs L/R and send 3 > IPS 33 in.  That way I had QV in stereo parallel and could send the 2 IPS 33 returns (2 different pitch shifts) into the QV.  I used the MC-1 with the MP-1 (and later the MXC with the MP-2).  I ran midi from the pedal into all 3 units.  If I wanted the same basic Fx for a patch (e.g. light stereo delay + reverb) I mapped that in the QV so a bunch of patches would map to the same QV patch.  If I wanted different Fx (say a longer mono delay + reverb) I programmed the QV for that patches midi program number.  The IPS33 was an early device and only recognises midi patches up to 90.  So I arranged all my patches to be above that (i.e. 110 - 119) which the IPS33 ignores.  When I wanted a pitch shift for a song, I'd bank down and select the number (e.g. 82) then bank up again (between songs on stage).  I then used a bypass switch (plugged into the IPS33) to turn the pitch shift on/off (and could use it for any MP-1/2 patch).  So at my feet/mike stand, I had midi switcher and bypass switch.  So the IPS33 was generally set to oct up A out and down B out.  But if I needed a different pitch shift (say for Highway Star solo, minor 3rd) which I'd programmed at patch 3 on the IPS33, I'd bank up to it (as it cycles) to select it, bypass it (bypass switch) then bank back to 112 (my main rhythm patch).  Initially I programmed the highway star harmony guitar line into the IPS33 (about 10 different patches) but I couldn't change them fast enough so just went with the main minor 3rd in the end (which also works fine for smoke on the water).

I could have programmed the IPS33 with lots of bypass patches etc. to line up with the MP-1/2 patches and not needed the bypass switch approach but for the amount of pitch shifting I was using it was overkill, so went simple.

My new live rack (I'm down sizing LoL) is 4 RU.  So MP-2, Midiverb 4 and B200s > stereo 2 x 12" cab.  This is the first time I've used the MP-2 loop.  Again I've mapped a basic st del + rev for most patches and just started to need other Fx for some songs, so programmed the MV4 for those  (well one so far).  The MP-2 has a stereo parallel loop and the wet/dry mix setting is programmable for each patch, so I now have the loop "in" on all patches.  The MP-1 loop is serial and mono so to have stereo Fx you need to chain the Fx device between the MP-1 and power amp (MP-1 A/B > Fx L/R in, L/R out > power amp.  This is how my friend MikeB runs his MP-1 rig with his TC GMaj.

As Harley said, there's lots of ways you can do it, it depends on what stuff you have and what you want to achieve.  His Ground Control lets him do a bunch of stuff that I'd need to find a different way to do (if I wanted to incorporate some other devices).  E.g. I stopped using the IPS33 quite a while ago, to bring it into the new rack would be problematic without using a mixer with enough Fx sends.

Your idea to use a MLC Dual Stereo Line Mixer MkII is similar (in essence) to how I use(d) the AM802 and makes sense as a way to do it.  To use your pedal board with the MP-1, you may want to split it.  Wah (do you have one?) and OD stuff are better in front of the MP-1, delay, rev etc. may be better in the MP-1 loop.  Chorus you won't need as the MP-1 chorus is to die for.

Wow, that gets complicated fast! How long did it take you to get your rig set up like that? Like did you know exactly what you wanted and knew how to do it, or did you have to mess around and use trial and error to get it to work properly? The more I learn about building rack rigs, the more I realize I don't know, lol.

Yep, I'll be splitting the pedalboard. Noise gate, tuner, SD-1, EQ, wah, etc in front of the MP-1. Then the noise gate, and a delay after the preamp. I'm not yet sure what to do as far as chorus, since I've heard how good the built in chorus is. But I can't use my noise gate properly if I'm going stereo out of the MP-1...

[Chase42147]

Hey Chase2147,
If I'm using MIDI multi-effects units, then I just leave the loop in all the time as I stated in my previous post. I always have a bypass preset in everything MIDI that I own, including the preamps. Usually, the last program patch is the one I set up for a bypass, (127, or 128, depending on the device). I've done it this way because in my large rack I have my MP-1, 3TM, and MP-2 in it. The reason for this method of bypassing the preamps I don't want to hear is because I found out after I purchased the GCX units, the way they switch things out of the signal path causes a ground issue with the ADAs, and so I took them out of the switch loops. It doesn't do this with effects, just the preamps. Some of the MIDI units I have also have a bypass built-in, such as the Lexicon MPX-1. For something like that, I just set it in bypass mode, and save it that way as a preset.
I forgot to mention, I also use a Rane SM-26 Splitter/Mixer to put the preamps into the audio signal path.

I can run my MIDI effects audio signal through the loops if I want to, but that's a lot more cabling and if you start building a rack, you'll figure that out fast. Even the non-MIDI effects aren't actually sending an audio signal through the GCX loops. I made custom cables to use in those loops to bypass or engage the effects by way of the footswitch jacks on the back of the units. The audio signal again is short patch cables that daisy-chain the effects in the preamp loop. That's for a simple stereo rig.
 
For a more complex rig for me, if I want to run some effects in parallel, I use a 2nd SM-26, and create three stereo channels, and route the effects I want in parallel to one of the other stereo paths, then blend it back in at the end of the effects chain. Nowadays, I think most multi-effects come with all that built into the units. The MPX-1 does, but the LXP-15II doesn't do that.

Anyway, if you have a way to bypass your effects via MIDI, then that would be the best way to do it. The less cables you run, the less chances for signal path issues you'll have.

Good to know about the ground issues. I wonder if that would be the same for all similar devices, or if the GCX and MP-1 specifically don't play nice together? Also, in the latter rig you described with parallel effects, what do you use as a mixer?

[Harley Hexxe]

Chase42147,

  I use the Rane SM-26 splitter/mixer. One to split the stereo path into six mono, or three stereo paths, then I use a second SM-26 to bring them back to a two channel stereo mix. It works both ways. Of course I don't have to mix it back down to two channels. I could run it out to three stereo power amps if I want to and use it that way.

   The ground issues only happened with the preamps when I ran the input signals through the GCX to go into each preamp. It's something about how the GCX shorts the signals to ground when taking them out of the signal path. That's when I came up with the idea to create a bypass preset in the preamps when I don't want them in the audio path. I think that the GCX system was created for pedal effects so you could mount them in your rack on a shelf, set them as you want them, and use the Ground Control to bring in, or take out any pedals you wanted with a single button. That way you didn't look like you were trying to put out a small fire on stage when changing effects. It was the pre-cursor to the modern pedal switchers that are out today. The non-MIDI rack effects I have work just fine in the loops of the GCX with no issues, but I prefer to use the loops as momentary switches to bypass those non-MIDI effects, (less cables, less signal degradation).

   I've been building racks since the late 80s, and controlling large racks has become easier as technology gets better, but then again, very few people use racks these days because you need a crew to move and set up the thing when it gets big enough. These days, there seem to be a lot of venues that don't allow a guitar player to bring in amplifiers so I've been working on building pedal boards that can be used with, or without amplifiers. I think I'm onto a good one at the present time. My rack gear only sees studio use these days.

[rnolan]

Wow, that gets complicated fast! How long did it take you to get your rig set up like that? Like did you know exactly what you wanted and knew how to do it, or did you have to mess around and use trial and error to get it to work properly? The more I learn about building rack rigs, the more I realize I don't know, lol.

Yep, I'll be splitting the pedalboard. Noise gate, tuner, SD-1, EQ, wah, etc in front of the MP-1. Then the noise gate, and a delay after the preamp. I'm not yet sure what to do as far as chorus, since I've heard how good the built in chorus is. But I can't use my noise gate properly if I'm going stereo out of the MP-1...

Hey Chase43147, I spose the short answer is yes, I knew exactly what I wanted to do (I spose it helps that I'm also a sound engineer and bringing it all together with a mixer and running it "like" a PA or studio session was sensible and easier (to me)).  The only sort of trial and error was using the IPS33 distortion loop, which I tried initially and later discarded, the rest was (for me) very straight forward i.e. I wanted stereo Fx in parallel and it's way easier to get the gain structure right using a mixer, particularly with a MP-1.  So The IPS33 has this "distortion" loop that lets you plug in the guitar to the input (clean/raw) to help tracking accuracy for making harmony notes.  The idea being that if the input is distorted (i.e. normal guitar shit), it's harder for it to work out the frequencies etc.  It then has a send and return for the distorted (or whatever) signal and applies the harmonies (that it worked out from the clean/raw input) to that, and then spits them out on its A/B outputs.  So I gave that a go, which was a pain as all the IPS33 ins and outs are on the back of the unit.  So I had to plug my guitar into the IPS33 rear input, take the IPS33 distortion loop output into my MP-1 input (which is on the front of the MP-1 (I had a top switch unit and its rear input is line level, so no good for this) and feed the 3rd Fx send of the mixer chan 1 & 2 (which are MP-1 A/B outs) back into the IPS33 distortion loop return.  So basically "inserting" the MP-1 into the IPS33 distortion loop.
Now this was a pain, as I had to plug my guitar cable over the back of the rack to access the IPS33 input  and take the IPS33 loop output back to the front to plug into the MP-1 input.  Allegedly, it was the right way to do it.  One day I decided to just plug direct into the MP-1, a better option for a bunch of reasons, send the 3rd Fx send to the IPS33 input, not worry about its distortion loop, and found the harmony tracking was fine, and my life was simpler and easier .  If there was a sound improvement from using the IPS33 dist loop, I would have persevered with it, but there wasn't, it tracked just fine.  So that's the extent of my trial and error with that rig.  The rest just made sense to do it that way.

Now I use a MP-2 which has a stereo parallel loop (doing much the same job as I used the mixer for with the MP-1).  Initially I didn't bother with it, but now I've down sized to a 4 RU rack (and don't have room for a mixer), I've started to use it.

It doesn't have to be complicated, it just depends what you want to do with whatever gear you have. E.g. Harley had a bunch of ADA delay units, which weren't midi compatible, but he wanted to use them with various settings for different song/patches etc. At the end of the day, you'd like to be able to press one button and get everything doing what it's supposed to to make that sound/tone/patch you want.  Hence he went the ground controller route and Rane SM-26 splitter/mixer which enabled him to achieve what he wanted.  I.e. he knew what he wanted in each patch, and it let him get there with the gear he had to hand.

Actually, Harleys large rack set up is way more complicated than what I was doing, but I get what he did, and why.

Also some people use their ADA preamps more like stomp boxes and have a bunch of preamps for each sound they want.  I've always made my MP-1/2 the centre piece and construct everything else around that.

For you, you'll have a bunch of stuff that you need to integrate into a "rig".  What you place where in your signal chain depends on a bunch of variables and outcomes.  The most important aspect is gain structure as getting that wrong can create unwanted noise, feedbacks, squeals etc.  But then what do you want it to sound like, e.g. do you want to distort a delayed clean sound or apply delay to a nice distortion sound.  Hence things like delay and reverb are generally best after the hi gain stages, i.e. make the tone, then apply those Fxs.  Wah tends to do better up front, before you distort it.  You also ave a SD1 (IIRC a distortion pedal).  Some like to use these in front of a MP-1, for me, I ask why even use it, the MP-1 distortion is way better and it has plenty (of gain), but each to their own...  Noise gate is probably better in the MP-1 loop, it's a mono serial loop and is after the MP-1 gain stage, so if you are chasing really hi gain settings, that's where it makes sense to put it.

Interestingly, my current approach has been to simplify things.  My current live rig is the most simple I've used in ages so Guitar > MP-2, Stereo multi Fx in MP-2 stereo loop > stereo power amp > stereo cab.  And Fx is basically slight short stereo delay + reverb.  Clean patch, dist rhythm patch, lead patch.

For MP-1 I'd go guitar > MP-1 > stereo multi Fx > stereo cab(s). As MP-1 loop is mono.

Ok so you have a pedal board with lots of things.  Where should they go in the signal chain? You need to get a good handle and understanding of the signal chain (i.e. guitar >>> stuff >>> speakers).

I'm not a fan of putting things in front of the MP-1, wah makes sense, possibly a volume pedal? nothing else makes sense (to me there).  Some like to drive the MP-1 input harder (mostly metal oriented guys) by using a boost or dist pedal. The MP-1 will do that better in spades IMHO.  So unless it makes a really particular sound you want, why???  But if it does float your boat, sure use it but be careful, dist pedals makes lots of gain, that's the MP-1s job and it generally does it way better.  EQ pedal, again why (probably to make the dist pedal sound decent), MP-1 has very good EQ, so do it there (much better gain structure and sounds better anyway).  Unless you have a very specific reason to use a EQ pedal (and hey some do), I'd ditch it. Chorus, do that in the MP-1, it will make whatever chorus pedal you have sound like shit (particularly if you run your MP-1 in stereo).  So things that make sense (to me) in the MP-1 loop, are noise gate (if you are going for really high gain sounds), mono delay, mono cab simulator (if you want to plug into a desk or recording thingy).  Stereo delay and stereo reverb should come after the MP-1.  Now you can (obviously) run the MP-1 in mono, but it really comes alive in stereo (well it's pseudo stereo, the B channel is 180 deg out of phase with the A channel).

[Harley Hexxe]

I'd like to add a little to what Richard just said here. While it's true the MP-1 does have a very good chorus, it's also true you don't need to limit yourself to that. In my large rack rig, I also had one S-1000 delay and one 'i" series delay set up for a deep chorus effect, set at different rates. I would use these with the chorus in my ADA preamps to create the tri-chorus effect. That's how I had that effect a few years before Eventide came out with it. I also used multiple flangers at the same time too, as well as varying delays with those units. Now, all those effects are coming out in pedals.

Actually Richard, that large rig isn't as complex as it may seem. Quite the opposite in fact. With the MP-1, I didn't run a lot in the effects loop, maybe just two delays set for chorus so they could be split into stereo through the MP-1. everything else was connected in series from the left and right outputs of the MP-1 to the power amps. The Ground Control gave me control over each individual MIDI unit in the rig, and the GCX merely bypassed the rest in the daisy chain. I pull gear out of that rig and stick other gear in there all the time just experimenting with the sounds. It's not really that hard for me, but then again, I've been doing it for a long time, and I built the whole thing from the ground up.

I had an IPS33 before I got the Eventide. That thing was such a time consuming pain in the ass because it isn't a harmonizer. IPS stands for " Intelligent Pitch Shifter," and it's called that because you have to go into it and program the "harmony" scale you want it to play when you play a specific input scale or mode. Which means every time you call up that preset, you had to play that input passage the same way note for note or it would glitch. After a few months of fussing with that, I gave up on that thing and opted for the Eventide. Now, if I want to improvise on a harmonized lead, I can call up the type of harmony I want and just go for it.

[Kazinator]

I'm not a fan of putting things in front of the MP-1, wah makes sense, possibly a volume pedal? nothing else makes sense (to me there).  Some like to drive the MP-1 input harder (mostly metal oriented guys) by using a boost or dist pedal

That makes almost no sense, because your OD pedal is not hitting a tube directly. It's hitting the MP-1's JFET buffer and built in OD. As a way of trying to get more distortion, no way.

It could make sense if you're only using the pedal to change the pre-distortion tone. I suspect it might be better to use the rear jack then.

The pedal can also provide an input level control, which is missing from the MP-1. I replaced the OD1 trimpot with an external knob to get this. If I change pickup height or plug in a hotter or quieter guitar, I can just tweak that rather than reprogram any presets.

Even that potentiometer is not a good way of trying to get more dirt, beyond compensating for pickup output.

I get a certain decently heavy tone with OD1 and 2 on 9.5 and 4.0. I adjust the externalized OD1 pot to get that tone, and no more than that. It's kind of a by ear calibration reference. Any more dist has to come from programming.

The exact numbers matter less than the consistency.

[Chase42147]

I'd like to add a little to what Richard just said here. While it's true the MP-1 does have a very good chorus, it's also true you don't need to limit yourself to that. In my large rack rig, I also had one S-1000 delay and one 'i" series delay set up for a deep chorus effect, set at different rates. I would use these with the chorus in my ADA preamps to create the tri-chorus effect. That's how I had that effect a few years before Eventide came out with it. I also used multiple flangers at the same time too, as well as varying delays with those units. Now, all those effects are coming out in pedals.

Actually Richard, that large rig isn't as complex as it may seem. Quite the opposite in fact. With the MP-1, I didn't run a lot in the effects loop, maybe just two delays set for chorus so they could be split into stereo through the MP-1. everything else was connected in series from the left and right outputs of the MP-1 to the power amps. The Ground Control gave me control over each individual MIDI unit in the rig, and the GCX merely bypassed the rest in the daisy chain. I pull gear out of that rig and stick other gear in there all the time just experimenting with the sounds. It's not really that hard for me, but then again, I've been doing it for a long time, and I built the whole thing from the ground up.

I had an IPS33 before I got the Eventide. That thing was such a time consuming pain in the ass because it isn't a harmonizer. IPS stands for " Intelligent Pitch Shifter," and it's called that because you have to go into it and program the "harmony" scale you want it to play when you play a specific input scale or mode. Which means every time you call up that preset, you had to play that input passage the same way note for note or it would glitch. After a few months of fussing with that, I gave up on that thing and opted for the Eventide. Now, if I want to improvise on a harmonized lead, I can call up the type of harmony I want and just go for it.

Ohh that's a good idea to get a tri-chorus! I love that sound, maybe I'll try to do the same. I was thinking of getting the Eventide Tricerachorus, but until then, that will work perfectly.

Also in response to your earlier post about building pedalboards that can be used without an amp, what kind of pedal amps do you use?

[Chase42147]

Hey Chase43147, I spose the short answer is yes, I knew exactly what I wanted to do (I spose it helps that I'm also a sound engineer and bringing it all together with a mixer and running it "like" a PA or studio session was sensible and easier (to me)).  The only sort of trial and error was using the IPS33 distortion loop, which I tried initially and later discarded, the rest was (for me) very straight forward i.e. I wanted stereo Fx in parallel and it's way easier to get the gain structure right using a mixer, particularly with a MP-1.  So The IPS33 has this "distortion" loop that lets you plug in the guitar to the input (clean/raw) to help tracking accuracy for making harmony notes.  The idea being that if the input is distorted (i.e. normal guitar shit), it's harder for it to work out the frequencies etc.  It then has a send and return for the distorted (or whatever) signal and applies the harmonies (that it worked out from the clean/raw input) to that, and then spits them out on its A/B outputs.  So I gave that a go, which was a pain as all the IPS33 ins and outs are on the back of the unit.  So I had to plug my guitar into the IPS33 rear input, take the IPS33 distortion loop output into my MP-1 input (which is on the front of the MP-1 (I had a top switch unit and its rear input is line level, so no good for this) and feed the 3rd Fx send of the mixer chan 1 & 2 (which are MP-1 A/B outs) back into the IPS33 distortion loop return.  So basically "inserting" the MP-1 into the IPS33 distortion loop.
Now this was a pain, as I had to plug my guitar cable over the back of the rack to access the IPS33 input  and take the IPS33 loop output back to the front to plug into the MP-1 input.  Allegedly, it was the right way to do it.  One day I decided to just plug direct into the MP-1, a better option for a bunch of reasons, send the 3rd Fx send to the IPS33 input, not worry about its distortion loop, and found the harmony tracking was fine, and my life was simpler and easier .  If there was a sound improvement from using the IPS33 dist loop, I would have persevered with it, but there wasn't, it tracked just fine.  So that's the extent of my trial and error with that rig.  The rest just made sense to do it that way.

Now I use a MP-2 which has a stereo parallel loop (doing much the same job as I used the mixer for with the MP-1).  Initially I didn't bother with it, but now I've down sized to a 4 RU rack (and don't have room for a mixer), I've started to use it.

It doesn't have to be complicated, it just depends what you want to do with whatever gear you have. E.g. Harley had a bunch of ADA delay units, which weren't midi compatible, but he wanted to use them with various settings for different song/patches etc. At the end of the day, you'd like to be able to press one button and get everything doing what it's supposed to to make that sound/tone/patch you want.  Hence he went the ground controller route and Rane SM-26 splitter/mixer which enabled him to achieve what he wanted.  I.e. he knew what he wanted in each patch, and it let him get there with the gear he had to hand.

Actually, Harleys large rack set up is way more complicated than what I was doing, but I get what he did, and why.

Also some people use their ADA preamps more like stomp boxes and have a bunch of preamps for each sound they want.  I've always made my MP-1/2 the centre piece and construct everything else around that.

For you, you'll have a bunch of stuff that you need to integrate into a "rig".  What you place where in your signal chain depends on a bunch of variables and outcomes.  The most important aspect is gain structure as getting that wrong can create unwanted noise, feedbacks, squeals etc.  But then what do you want it to sound like, e.g. do you want to distort a delayed clean sound or apply delay to a nice distortion sound.  Hence things like delay and reverb are generally best after the hi gain stages, i.e. make the tone, then apply those Fxs.  Wah tends to do better up front, before you distort it.  You also ave a SD1 (IIRC a distortion pedal).  Some like to use these in front of a MP-1, for me, I ask why even use it, the MP-1 distortion is way better and it has plenty (of gain), but each to their own...  Noise gate is probably better in the MP-1 loop, it's a mono serial loop and is after the MP-1 gain stage, so if you are chasing really hi gain settings, that's where it makes sense to put it.

Interestingly, my current approach has been to simplify things.  My current live rig is the most simple I've used in ages so Guitar > MP-2, Stereo multi Fx in MP-2 stereo loop > stereo power amp > stereo cab.  And Fx is basically slight short stereo delay + reverb.  Clean patch, dist rhythm patch, lead patch.

For MP-1 I'd go guitar > MP-1 > stereo multi Fx > stereo cab(s). As MP-1 loop is mono.

Ok so you have a pedal board with lots of things.  Where should they go in the signal chain? You need to get a good handle and understanding of the signal chain (i.e. guitar >>> stuff >>> speakers).

I'm not a fan of putting things in front of the MP-1, wah makes sense, possibly a volume pedal? nothing else makes sense (to me there).  Some like to drive the MP-1 input harder (mostly metal oriented guys) by using a boost or dist pedal. The MP-1 will do that better in spades IMHO.  So unless it makes a really particular sound you want, why???  But if it does float your boat, sure use it but be careful, dist pedals makes lots of gain, that's the MP-1s job and it generally does it way better.  EQ pedal, again why (probably to make the dist pedal sound decent), MP-1 has very good EQ, so do it there (much better gain structure and sounds better anyway).  Unless you have a very specific reason to use a EQ pedal (and hey some do), I'd ditch it. Chorus, do that in the MP-1, it will make whatever chorus pedal you have sound like shit (particularly if you run your MP-1 in stereo).  So things that make sense (to me) in the MP-1 loop, are noise gate (if you are going for really high gain sounds), mono delay, mono cab simulator (if you want to plug into a desk or recording thingy).  Stereo delay and stereo reverb should come after the MP-1.  Now you can (obviously) run the MP-1 in mono, but it really comes alive in stereo (well it's pseudo stereo, the B channel is 180 deg out of phase with the A channel).

That's cool that you're a sound engineer! That would be super helpful for a lot! How long have you been doing that for?

As far as my pedalboard, that's just my standard pedalboard, a lot of stuff on it is for specific things. The SD-1 (overdrive) is used exclusively for boosting Marshall amps. The 6-band EQ does get used with the MP-1, I saw Euge Valovirta on Youtube boost his that way, and it sounded fantastic. I just barely boost some of the mid frequencies.

How does it work when outputs A and B are out of phase with each other? Is it only when speakers are out of phase they  cancel each other out?

I replied a few minutes ago and then my work computer crashed as I was posting it, so if there are two similar posts by me, that is why haha.

[Chase42147]

On the weekend, I finally got the center positive 9V DC power adapter. Nothing happened when I plugged it into the MCX (screen didn't turn on), so either the footswitch is shot, or it has to be connected to the preamp for the footswitch screen to turn on?

[Harley Hexxe]

On the weekend, I finally got the center positive 9V DC power adapter. Nothing happened when I plugged it into the MCX (screen didn't turn on), so either the footswitch is shot, or it has to be connected to the preamp for the footswitch screen to turn on?

If you have a multimeter, check the barrel plug to confirm you are getting the correct voltage from the adapter and that it's working. Just because it's new, doesn't mean it's good.

Keep in mind, that the way I was getting that tri-chorus effect was using ADA rack mounted delays. These all produce their effects with what's called delay modulation. It's a different flavor than pitch modulation which is what the Eventide actually uses. Both are great sounding effects though.

As for the pedal rig, if you are asking for the pedals I'm using to produce the amp tones with, I'm using Crazy Tube Circuits Crossfire for the Fender-ish clean tones and boost. For more crunchy sounds, I'm using the CTC Space Charged V2, but I'm also messing with the Earthquaker Devices Monarch, which is very much like a vintage OR-120. I like both, but I'm leaning more toward the Space Charged V2. For high gain stuff, I have an older version of the CTC Black Magic which sounds a lot like a JCM800 on steroids. The EQD Talons is very close to the Black Magic.
For the pedal effects so far, I'm using the TC Electronic SCF Gold reissue for stereo wide, and two 2290P pedals. One for the modulation effects, one for the delay effects after that. I may also add a reverb pedal. So far, with what I have, the fidelity is so surprisingly good, I may not need power amp/cab simulator pedals, but I have a couple that are really good in case I do.

[rnolan]

Hey Chase42147, the MXC should work with just a power adapter plugged into it.  That's generally how I program it (initially).  You can do a reset, set midi channel, set expression pedal (1 & 2) range and modify the CC# (if you want) for RTM CC stuff.  As well as check that the adapter is putting out 9v DC 500ma with a multi meter (as Harley said), maybe give the socket on the MXC a clean with contact cleaner (they don't get used often and can maybe gum up), and also make sure you have a snug fit and the right tip on the adapter cable.

So I've been a sound engineer for 44+ years and it is handy . And maybe partly why I set up my MP-1 and MP-2 rigs with a mixer and run it like a PA, just made sense to me, made getting the gain structure easier and let me run the Quadverb in stereo in a parallel configuration.

So as the MP-1/2 are sort of "pseudo" stereo, as in the A and B outs are 180 deg out of phase, it does work better with separate cabs which are spaced apart (a rack width works ok).  I like some kind of separator in a single cab wired stereo to minimise any interactions inside the cab (e.g. I get a bit of comb filtering in one ADA slant split stack I have wired stereo, gets a little flangy, but it will be hard to put something in to separate the 2 x 12"s).  The one trick you'll like with the MP-1 running in stereo is, set the chorus depth 100 and rate 0, this gives a ~40ms delay and creates a really fat tone .

[Harley Hexxe]

The one trick you'll like with the MP-1 running in stereo is, set the chorus depth 100 and rate 0, this gives a ~40ms delay and creates a really fat tone .

+1 

This is essentially what I do with the SCF on my pedalboard. BIG stereo guitar sound!

[Chase42147]

If you have a multimeter, check the barrel plug to confirm you are getting the correct voltage from the adapter and that it's working. Just because it's new, doesn't mean it's good.

Keep in mind, that the way I was getting that tri-chorus effect was using ADA rack mounted delays. These all produce their effects with what's called delay modulation. It's a different flavor than pitch modulation which is what the Eventide actually uses. Both are great sounding effects though.

As for the pedal rig, if you are asking for the pedals I'm using to produce the amp tones with, I'm using Crazy Tube Circuits Crossfire for the Fender-ish clean tones and boost. For more crunchy sounds, I'm using the CTC Space Charged V2, but I'm also messing with the Earthquaker Devices Monarch, which is very much like a vintage OR-120. I like both, but I'm leaning more toward the Space Charged V2. For high gain stuff, I have an older version of the CTC Black Magic which sounds a lot like a JCM800 on steroids. The EQD Talons is very close to the Black Magic.
For the pedal effects so far, I'm using the TC Electronic SCF Gold reissue for stereo wide, and two 2290P pedals. One for the modulation effects, one for the delay effects after that. I may also add a reverb pedal. So far, with what I have, the fidelity is so surprisingly good, I may not need power amp/cab simulator pedals, but I have a couple that are really good in case I do.

Ok, will do! I meant to check it this weekend but things got chaotic as summer weekends tend to all too often...

Ohh gotcha, I didn't actually realize there was a difference until now. One more thing to experiment with!

That's cool, I looked into those pedals, they look great! It's amazing how far the pedal technology has come, that not only can a pedal sound passable, but actually nearly the same as a tube amp. How's the feel of your pedal rig compared to an amp?

[Chase42147]

Hey Chase42147, the MXC should work with just a power adapter plugged into it.  That's generally how I program it (initially).  You can do a reset, set midi channel, set expression pedal (1 & 2) range and modify the CC# (if you want) for RTM CC stuff.  As well as check that the adapter is putting out 9v DC 500ma with a multi meter (as Harley said), maybe give the socket on the MXC a clean with contact cleaner (they don't get used often and can maybe gum up), and also make sure you have a snug fit and the right tip on the adapter cable.

So I've been a sound engineer for 44+ years and it is handy . And maybe partly why I set up my MP-1 and MP-2 rigs with a mixer and run it like a PA, just made sense to me, made getting the gain structure easier and let me run the Quadverb in stereo in a parallel configuration.

So as the MP-1/2 are sort of "pseudo" stereo, as in the A and B outs are 180 deg out of phase, it does work better with separate cabs which are spaced apart (a rack width works ok).  I like some kind of separator in a single cab wired stereo to minimise any interactions inside the cab (e.g. I get a bit of comb filtering in one ADA slant split stack I have wired stereo, gets a little flangy, but it will be hard to put something in to separate the 2 x 12"s).  The one trick you'll like with the MP-1 running in stereo is, set the chorus depth 100 and rate 0, this gives a ~40ms delay and creates a really fat tone .

Good idea on cleaning it, with older gear that's probably always a good thing to do. The fit is good, but maybe the center hole is too big... I'll have to take another look.

Oh wow, so you're a seasoned pro! Mixers really do seem like the way to go. The ability to run FX in parallel alone is worth it.

My MP-1 had something like that saved to preset 3 (not sure if it's from factory or from the previous owner) but damn that sounded huge. And I was only running it through a 4x12 with stereo inputs. My other 4x12 is at my drummer's house lol, I'll have to bring it home soon to properly hear the stereo effect!