Focusrite Scarlett 18i20

[rnolan]

Hey Harley, I hear you, like me you just want it to work. I have no problem with making things more simple, but I stand by what I said about MACs approach.  I like a scroll wheel and right mouse menus, that doesn't exist in MAC land (it can, MAC is based on BSD Unix but they don't.. ).  That aside, I just posted what I've done recently and it works which is where you are wanting to get to. All easy and now I'm functional.  I don't know if the Focusrite works with a MAC?  I do know (because I tried one) that the PreSonus is better (sounds better, better controls (e.g. level knob for each of the 8 inputs), and connects way better..).  Hey allot of this stuff was developed for MAC in the early days e.g. Cubase was originally written for Ataris running the Motorola 6800 chips set, same as early MACs.  MACs now run an Intel chip set BTW.  I'm sure you can get a MAC to work fine, but that direction is typically more expensive.  You made a comment about MACs being easy to network, not sure what you are basing that on but the opposite is the reality.

From my perspective, I'd just like to see you get a good system up and running, whatever you choose.

I will give a plug for Win11 though.  It's better in lots of ways to Win10.

When I fire up my system now, everything works. I have a hub thingy that drives 2 monitors (it can do 4) with lots of additional USB connections (type C and A) which connects to my MSI laptop via a USB C Thunderbolt 4, PreSonus connects to the hub, everything happy...  just saying.

[Harley Hexxe]

Richard,

   Not easier for networking, but better. None of the virus' or trojans or worms affect Macs. They use a different system. Plus, I don't like the idea of installing anti-virus programs. Those things are running in the background constantly, and they eat up processing power in windows PCs. Nothing is more frustrating than being in the middle of a hot recording and nailing it, then all of a sudden your PC freezes. There was too much going on at the same time and it choked. I've lost count how many times that's happened.

   Yes, a Mac is a more costly investment. I can't argue that, but I will point out another fact. Just about every artist who is anybody, is using Mac. Is that just a coincidence? I think not. Anyway, after 30 some years fussing with win-blows and all the stupid additional software that you have to buy in a lot of cases, I'm ready for a switch to something different.
   I'll start with a laptop and see how it does with what I've got. I've already paid a lot of money for Cubase, and a few other software add-ons for it. I'd like to produce something out of it after all that.

   Oh yes, as a foot note, I was checking into a HP with windows 11 and what I needed for it to do, and it's right there at the same price as the Mac. Either way, it's going to cost me a chunk of change. No way around it.

[rnolan]

Hey Harley, unfortunately the idea MACs aren't affected by virus' or trojans or worms is a myth.  My day job includes researching vulnerabilities and attacks and MACs are right up there these days .  The myth comes from a time when the bad guys went for the biggest footprint, which is Windows.  Now everything gets attacked.  Moreover, worms were first developed for Unix systems, and the MAC OS is based on BSD flavour Unix.

The first thing I did when I got the MSI was uninstall Noton AV (seems to come on everything these days).  The anti virus anti malware built into Windows (defender? the name keeps changing) works fine, gets regular signature updates and doesn't get in the way at all.

One thing to be aware of if you go MAC, and hey they are great PCs, is the base models don't support multiple monitors, you have to go to the M3 Pro for 2 monitors or the M3 Max for up to 4. Either MAC or Windows you'll need a hub/dock thingy.  I went with this one (https://satechi.net/products/thunderbolt-4-multimedia-pro-dock) which works great. So it seems the biggest MAC display is 16", my MSI is 17" and it's too small for what we want to do.  So I have it in the middle with a 24" monitor either side connected via Display port which is a little better than HDMI albeit the hub/dock supports either.

Anyway, don't skimp on the MAC, it will cost more but go high end i.e. M3 Max 16" with as much RAM as it can take (min 64GB).  Hopefully Cubase will be happier on a MAC? that's where they came from way back when (as did Pro Tools). And more so the 18i20, it says it works for MacOS.

As you say, it's going to cost a chunk of change, as it has for me.  In the end I'm glad I spent the money as I now have an up to date system which works really well (little bit of future proofing LoL).

[Dante]

I've been using Macs forever. You can easily mirror your display or use the HDMI port to run a TV for a monitor, I have a 48" monitor (LED TV) hooked up to a 2015 MacBook Pro.

PCs are disposable, you rarely keep them more than a few years, then get another one. My Macs last me 10 years....easily. Why drive a VW when you could drive a Mercedes? 

More expensive? Sure. Worth it? Absolutely

Garageband will get you VERY far to record your ideas. If  you want to 'master' your tracks further, you can open Garageband files with Logic. Cubase is not all that different and you'd probably have a relatively easy time using Garageband.

FYI: I haven't seen a virus since the 90s, maybe it's happening in the background and I don't see it

[Harley Hexxe]

@ Richard,

  I'm not too concerned with running multiple monitors since I'm only looking at a laptop. I don't do that with them anyway.

   Since the price point is pretty close on both, and I'm just sick of win-blows, I think it's time to try something different and see how that works out.

  I know that Focusrite claims the 18i20 will work on Mac as well, but the real question is will it work the same way it's working now? I've always dealt with issues using software that needs a lot of processing power with Micro-shaft PCs, even when I built my own using the best processors, motherboards, etc., and still had these kinds of issues.

   I'm going to go with a good laptop to start with and install my interface with it and see what I get when everything is installed. Then I'll have a better idea if it's the interface or the pc. One thing I can tell you for certain, I'll never get another Dell for as long as I live. We got new computers at my job just two years ago, and they are total garbage. We are constantly calling I.T. to help resolve issues with these damned things. Yep, you guessed it, they're all Dells.

[Harley Hexxe]

@ Dante,

    I know you've been using Macs for a long time, and you swear by them. I don't know how many other members here use Macs so it's a singular point of reference, but you seem to not have issues like I've had.

    I've never used GarageBand or Logic. I've heard other people heap praise on Logic, but not too many talk about Garageband. I also remember you not having issues with viruses and other stupid things that Micro-shaft users have to watch out for.

    Anyway, as I told Richard, I'm only looking at a laptop right now to see if it's going to work out. What I'll be looking for is: how well I can navigate my way around the Mac OS, how well I can connect my audio hardware and install my software in it, and how it will handle it. I'm not really looking to use the laptop as a full blown DAW, but at the most maybe as a portable studio recording device with a smaller interface. If it holds up with what I've got now and doesn't drop its connections with the hardware or glitch the software, then I might consider upgrading to a more powerful desktop.
   If you have any suggestions or recommendations about what I should be looking for in a Mac, (like Richard has), I'm open to it. This is all uncharted territory for me.
   I should mention that when I do get the laptop, I mainly want to use it for networking and maybe shooting some video content on it. I can't do that with any of my pcs because they won't even hold together just trying to make audio recordings.

[rnolan]

Hey Harley, if you go for a high end Macbook Pro it should do everything you want and work fine as a "DAW" and also for video.  You shouldn't need a new desk top as the latest Laptops are as good and often better.  And if you need a couple of extra monitors, as Dante says you can use the HDMI out to connect one.  I suggested the hub/dock thing as it gives you lots of additional connections to plug in a mouse, keyboard, monitors etc. (network port as well if you need it, which the Macbook Pro don't have, they use wireless).  I'm really happy with my hi end MSI laptop, I usually run it with the dock and additional monitors but can take it with me and use it stand alone.  Big upside with the Mac laptops is much better battery life between charges.  That's the one down side of my MSI, it's good for 3 to 4 hours only.  The M3 Max I suggested is 22hours, impressive.

Edit: Had a look at a friends Macbook Pro tonight, great news, the mouse has left and right click and scrolls in the middle, even better, it has no cable to connect to the Laptop, you just have to charge it up from time to time.  Even better apart from being really sleek, the top is continuous, no cracks for dust to get.  Very elegant design. I don't know how easy it is to add RAM to a Macbook, some laptops are easy and some are a pain.  Mine (MSI) allegedly is a pain so I ordered it all loaded up with 64GB so I didn't have to think about it later.

[Dante]

Laptop RAM memory is not that hard to upgrade, I've done that to all my laptops. I guess it's quite a challenge on some older iMacs, but that's another topic....I don't use the display on my laptop at all, just the bigass TV. 

The TV was handy when my eyes were bad, now that they're fixed, it's way better.  I have tons of real estate

Yes, the current Mac Magic Mouse is sleek on top and has all the clicks and a (hidden) scroll wheel....HOWEVER, the charging cable port is on the BOTTOM of the mouse. You cannot use the mouse when charging.  That is a design flaw

As for advice on buying a Mac, I've always gotten refurbished machines that were 2 or 3 years old. Half the price, still reliable as hell and usually come with Apple care (from a reputable dealer). Sure, they may use a chip that's been improved, but I don't need the latest greatest CPU...

[Harley Hexxe]

Richard,

   I'll keep that in mind, but I will still go with a desktop even if I have a laptop. I don't like to use the desktop for networking, which is why I choose to use a laptop for that.
   I intended to get a hub for the laptop anyway since the USB connections are limited on those.

   As far as external monitors, these two I have now can work with HDMI, and they are connected with adapters.

[Harley Hexxe]

Dante,

    I'll look for refurbished Macs and see what's out here. The place I went to was the Apple Store, so I think all they had was new machines. I'll look around though.

   Thanks for the tip, I didn't even think of that until you mentioned it.

[rnolan]

Hey Dante, the newer thinner laptops can be a bit harder to get at the RAM as obviously the space inside is at a premium.  When I read that about the MSI I was buying, which is as thin as a Macbook Pro, you have to dismantle it a bit to get at the RAM, so not as straight forward as it was/is with thicker older units.  Hence I decided stuff that and just bought it loaded up.  I went new and high end, the last laptop I have I bought over 15 years ago and I wanted to future proof myself a bit.  Also the MSI is a gaming/creative model, and gaming machines are always really high spec.  These are the people (gamers) who have liquid cooling systems for the CPU (like a car radiator).

@Harley, when you said networking, I miss understood you I think.  To me that means running on a corporate network etc. which Macs are not particularly easy to incorporate.  But if you just mean connecting to your wireless router/modem thingy and accessing the internet, I don't think of that as networking, although I spose strictly it is in a way.  The monitor limitation came up when I was buying the Satechi dock.  At that time Macs only supported 2 external monitors.  When I looked the other day I noticed the M3 Max has addressed that and it can now support 4 (in that model) as does Win11.  Of course you also need a decent graphics card.  But I'm good with 2 which gives me 3 screens which I find handy for recording, well mostly mixing as the FX and bus windows etc. can be on other screens.  While buying refurbished Macs may be cost effective now, I wouldn't (given what you want and are doing).  Mac OSs get deprecated faster that Windows.  There's lots of people who can't apply security patches (and Dante, they come thick and fast these days, I see them every other day in my job) to their Apple things.  Not that this doesn't also happen in Windows, it's just Window is supported much longer due partly to it's huge footprint in enterprise organisations.

Anyway Harley, I just decided to bight the bullet, spend the money and upgrade everything, coz, like you, I was over it and just wanted everything to work.  And I'm glad I did, now I'm good for another 10 years (I hope LoL).

[Harley Hexxe]

Hey Richard,

   Yeah, I should have been a bit more specific regarding the networking. You see, I have a room in my basement that I've set up for recording, and that's where the desktop is going to be. I use the laptop when I'm upstairs to get on the internet. I still want to transfer files from the desktop to the laptop though, so the machines need to connect seamlessly. This way, I don't need to be in my basement when I get online to post finished recordings.