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Author Topic: A dry Marshall picking clip, needs my MP1 magic that I'm waiting for!  (Read 2203 times)

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Harley Hexxe

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Danny,

   I bought the first H3000 when it got into the stores here in 1988. I still have it, but I've upgraded the chipset to the H3500DX now. It has everything you could possibly put in it. I also still have my Lexicon gear as well, MPX-1, LXP-15II, and a few others, which have the best reverbs you could ever want, plus several other effects that are useful in a guitar rig, but there again, most of the effects in the Lexicons, and quite a few in the Eventide are better suited for the mixing desk rather than guitar amps. That's where I have to bring these effects in parallel to my guitar tone, and mind my mix levels with them.
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Harley Hexxe

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Danny,

  The Classic is a fantastic sounding preamp when you really want to get that vintage amp tone as opposed to the more modern tones of the 80s. That has more vintage vibe than the original MP-1.
   Yes it does have the Brown tube voicing as well as a stereo effects loop and built in noise gate which I though were excellent additions to it. In my personal opinion, it has the weakest chorus effect of the three preamps ADA made, and I always supplemented that with one of my S-1000s, or Digitizer 4s,
    It also doesn't have as much low end as the original MP-1, so I did some tube rolling to try to make that a little better, and the closest I came to that was a pair of GT 12AX7R2 in it which did give a mild boost to the bass and mids in the preamp, but it still needed help from the power amp for more low end. I wrote a review on that a long time ago on here.
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rnolan

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Hey DJC, that setup has served me well for many years, I have the mixer velcroed to the bottom of my 8RU SKB rack (you can just see it in this pic).  The MP-2 noise gate has Fader/Gate and threshold settings.  I use Fader setting rather than Gate which avoids the "splat"

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DannyjoeCarter

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Danny,

   I bought the first H3000 when it got into the stores here in 1988. I still have it, but I've upgraded the chipset to the H3500DX now. It has everything you could possibly put in it. I also still have my Lexicon gear as well, MPX-1, LXP-15II, and a few others, which have the best reverbs you could ever want, plus several other effects that are useful in a guitar rig, but there again, most of the effects in the Lexicons, and quite a few in the Eventide are better suited for the mixing desk rather than guitar amps. That's where I have to bring these effects in parallel to my guitar tone, and mind my mix levels with them.


That's awesome Harley - killer gear there my friend! That stuff will never be replaced because of its specific sound. I find there is a spirit and special voice to that studio gear from the mid 80s that is just so unique!
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DannyjoeCarter

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Danny,

  The Classic is a fantastic sounding preamp when you really want to get that vintage amp tone as opposed to the more modern tones of the 80s. That has more vintage vibe than the original MP-1.
   Yes it does have the Brown tube voicing as well as a stereo effects loop and built in noise gate which I though were excellent additions to it. In my personal opinion, it has the weakest chorus effect of the three preamps ADA made, and I always supplemented that with one of my S-1000s, or Digitizer 4s,
    It also doesn't have as much low end as the original MP-1, so I did some tube rolling to try to make that a little better, and the closest I came to that was a pair of GT 12AX7R2 in it which did give a mild boost to the bass and mids in the preamp, but it still needed help from the power amp for more low end. I wrote a review on that a long time ago on here.


 Thank you Harley for that update; right off the bat tonight I noticed how much gain this original 2.0 MP-1 has - crazy gain and I can't even imagine adding a third tube like the 3TM mod! Funny thing is I didn't remember it being this high gain but I love it!
And from your description I'm not going to bother with the Classic - I like voicing just perfect!   :whoohoo!:
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DannyjoeCarter

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Hey DJC, that setup has served me well for many years, I have the mixer velcroed to the bottom of my 8RU SKB rack (you can just see it in this pic).  The MP-2 noise gate has Fader/Gate and threshold settings.  I use Fader setting rather than Gate which avoids the "splat"


Awesome pics - now that's just sexy looking R!
And that's great point about the fader setting - I didn't remember that - I only had for maybe a week and returned it. You know how your ear gets used to a certain sound and sometimes you dismiss something right off? Well I did and I supposed I didn't give it a chance.


 But hey like Harley was telling about the Classic, does the MP-2 have a different voicing than the MP-1? I'm just loving this MP-1's tone so much again after all these years!
I'm curious if the MP-2 starts with the MP-1 and adds from that point or it's completely different?
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Harley Hexxe

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That's awesome Harley - killer gear there my friend! That stuff will never be replaced because of its specific sound. I find there is a spirit and special voice to that studio gear from the mid 80s that is just so unique!

I tend to agree with you Danny.
If you look at the current trend in effects pedals, it seems the current owners of the Eventide name also feel that way because they've been releasing pedals that are based on isolated algorithms found in the H3000. I forgot who bought the company, but it's obvious where all these pedals are coming from. (Tricerochorus, Black Hole, etc.).
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Harley Hexxe

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But hey like Harley was telling about the Classic, does the MP-2 have a different voicing than the MP-1? I'm just loving this MP-1's tone so much again after all these years!
I'm curious if the MP-2 starts with the MP-1 and adds from that point or it's completely different?

Danny,
I had a very good relationship with Todd Langner when he was the head of ADA Tech service, and we had a conversation about that in the early 90s, right after I bought my first Classic. I'll share what he told me about the preamps with you.

MP-1 has three voices, SS, Clean Tube, and Distortion Tube. Because of its design, there is a certain percentage of solid state voice mixed in with each of the tube voices, no matter which stored preset or created preset you use.

MP-2 has ten tube voices only, no solid state. It's a completely different circuit design from the MP-1, so it really doesn't sound like the MP-1 at all. It wasn't meant to. It was designed to put every option into one small package that could produce and tube amp tone you wanted if you tweaked it properly. This preamp was a collaboration between Dave Tarnowski, Todd Langner, and Matt Bacchi.

MP-1 Classic has one Solid State voice, and three tube voices, Clean Tube, Distortion Tube, and Brown Tube. Unlike the original MP-1, the solid state voice is isolated from the tube voices, so whichever voice you select, that is the only voice you'll hear from the Classic.

What brought that conversation about was an issue I was having with the MP-2, which I had already owned two of those by the time I got the Classic. I was trying to get some of the programs I had created in the MP-1 into the MP-2 and into the Classic. When I would get close, it still didn't sound quite right, and I would lose my picking dynamics in the MP-2. I would get closer with the Classic, and that would have excellent picking dynamics, but the tones were not quite "in-your-face" as they were with the original MP-1. That's when Todd explained all this to me.

So taking a step back, and looking at these preamps, you have to consider each of these as their own unique personalities, and they all have their strengths and weaknesses just like any amplifier in the world. So I use each one for it's strengths.
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DannyjoeCarter

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But hey like Harley was telling about the Classic, does the MP-2 have a different voicing than the MP-1? I'm just loving this MP-1's tone so much again after all these years!
I'm curious if the MP-2 starts with the MP-1 and adds from that point or it's completely different?

Danny,
I had a very good relationship with Todd Langner when he was the head of ADA Tech service, and we had a conversation about that in the early 90s, right after I bought my first Classic. I'll share what he told me about the preamps with you.

MP-1 has three voices, SS, Clean Tube, and Distortion Tube. Because of its design, there is a certain percentage of solid state voice mixed in with each of the tube voices, no matter which stored preset or created preset you use.

MP-2 has ten tube voices only, no solid state. It's a completely different circuit design from the MP-1, so it really doesn't sound like the MP-1 at all. It wasn't meant to. It was designed to put every option into one small package that could produce and tube amp tone you wanted if you tweaked it properly. This preamp was a collaboration between Dave Tarnowski, Todd Langner, and Matt Bacchi.

MP-1 Classic has one Solid State voice, and three tube voices, Clean Tube, Distortion Tube, and Brown Tube. Unlike the original MP-1, the solid state voice is isolated from the tube voices, so whichever voice you select, that is the only voice you'll hear from the Classic.

What brought that conversation about was an issue I was having with the MP-2, which I had already owned two of those by the time I got the Classic. I was trying to get some of the programs I had created in the MP-1 into the MP-2 and into the Classic. When I would get close, it still didn't sound quite right, and I would lose my picking dynamics in the MP-2. I would get closer with the Classic, and that would have excellent picking dynamics, but the tones were not quite "in-your-face" as they were with the original MP-1. That's when Todd explained all this to me.

So taking a step back, and looking at these preamps, you have to consider each of these as their own unique personalities, and they all have their strengths and weaknesses just like any amplifier in the world. So I use each one for it's strengths.


 Harley thank you for another great run down and wealth of information my friend! And it makes sense what you're saying because even with Marshalls many times there isn't too much of a cross over more so than introducing something new! And it seems the same with the ADAs!   :)
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rnolan

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Wow Harley, thanks so much for sharing that explanation  :thumb-up: , I didn't know that about the SS being incorporated into the MP-1s voicing.  When I moved to MP-2 I took the same approach as with MP-1, Copied patch 1 to a new bank and tweaked it to sound how I liked.  I've started (after all these years) to experiment with the other MP-2 voices.  For now I've settled on Voice 5 Warm vintage but I want to chase something with even less distortion but not clean.  I also want to play around with the MP-2 macros (which I've never used before). 
When I listen to older recordings I did with the MP-1 I get quite nostalgic for the tones I had.  As you say, the MP-2 is a very different beast to the MP-1. 
I don't think the distributor here in Oz (Pro Audio) ever brought in the Classic, we also never saw any of the ADA effects so I've never had the chance to try one. 
In the end the approach could be (as MJMP and Harley does) use different preamps for their strengths.  So you could have all 3 in a rack and use some input switching to select the tone you want.  When I get one of my MP-1s working properly (currently one works but midi is broken and the other doesn't boot any more  :facepalm: ) I'll install it into the 8RU rack and use an A/B A+B switch in front.
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Harley Hexxe

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Danny,

   Yes, they did want to constantly improve and offer more options for tweaking their preamps at ADA, but that kind of backfired with the MP-2. It was so in-depth with all of it's programming and editing options, that most guitar players were overwhelmed by it. That's why a few months after buying the MP-2, you'd see them back in the stores for sale as used gear for very low prices.

   When the Classic came out a few years later, they simplified the interface and programming back to the original MP-1s standard.

   I'll admit that I was pretty overwhelmed with the MP-2 myself at first, and put both of them in a closet for about 8 years. I pulled them out and resolved to make myself spend the time to learn how to use it as effectively as the MP-1. It took a while with a lot of referencing to the manual, but I did finally figure it out, and added the MXC controller with a Quad Switch and CC pedal, which really brings out the great potential the MP-2 has.
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Harley Hexxe

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Richard,

   It kind of took me by surprise to learn that about the MP-1 too.

   I don't really see any advantage in using the macros in the MP-2, as it really doesn't seem to have any more to offer than you already get with the MIDI and RTM functions. That just seems like a different way to store program edit combinations.

   I would caution you about using the A/B and A/B/Y pedals to feed the inputs of the ADA preamps. Those pedals switch by grounding out the channel you don't want to use, and that will probably introduce noise into your guitar signal path. I've already experienced that myself. What I've resolved to do instead to fix that issue, was to dedicate a program location in each preamp to be a dead quiet setting, (effectively shutting off the preamp), which in my case is program 128. Since you know already that one of my MIDI controller systems is the Voodoo Labs Ground Control, and two GCX Switchers, I can send independent program change commands to each MIDI unit on their own channels simultaneously, so I can do that. That's how I'm going to set up my 22U rack when I get back to it. I'm not sure If I'll include power amps in that rack yet, considering the number of ADA rack effects I have, I may put the power amps in a smaller, separate rack case which may work better.

   As for why you never saw the ADA effects in Australia, that could be because a year or so after they introduced the MP-1, ADA decided to discontinue their effects processor line, and concentrate on their guitar systems only at that point. When ADA did introduce the MP-1, the only effects processors they were producing by that time was the Digitizer 4, Pitchtraq, and MQ-1 Programmable Equalizer. All the other delays we've talked about here on the Forum were already obsolete and replaced with the D4. A clue to when that happened is when ADAs logo changed from "ADA Signal Processors" to "ADA Amplification Systems." You can sort of figure that out from the TRENDZ magazine ADA was putting out.
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MarshallJMP

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Harley, do you know when the STD-1 and TFX4 came out? These are the only anolog units I could find here in europe that had 220V. Never found the S1000 or the i series in 220V. The D4,MQ-1 and Pitchraq are also imported as 220V units.

I still really love my Digitizer, I find it to be an amazing delay unit, especially when used in stereo.
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DannyjoeCarter

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Danny,

   Yes, they did want to constantly improve and offer more options for tweaking their preamps at ADA, but that kind of backfired with the MP-2. It was so in-depth with all of it's programming and editing options, that most guitar players were overwhelmed by it. That's why a few months after buying the MP-2, you'd see them back in the stores for sale as used gear for very low prices.


Yes I saw this here in Vegas - MP2s and Classics everywhere for sale and less money than the MP-1s! And so many guys jut tucked their MP-1s away but the market seemed to be flooded with the others.
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rnolan

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Hey Harley, well that makes much more sense of it.  What happened here in Oz, I saw an advert for a programmable preamp, not the MP-1 and at the time I was using my 73 Marshall through a power soak (so you could be in the same room as it  >:D ) but I had no lead boost  :facepalm: .  Nunzio Gambale (Franks Brother) who owned Pro Audio asked us what we wanted him to look out for at the NAMM show he was going to, so we (I) told him I wanted a programmable tube preamp that sounded as good as my Marshall but let me have a lead boost.  He came back with the MP-1 and I was in heaven. Later on he made the split stacks/cabs etc here under licence.  So we got MP-1, MB-1 (he's a bass player), B200s, B500b and G500s and later MP-2, no effects. 

Interesting with MP-2, I get why some find it confusing, for me it was like, yeah hupp, bring it on but then I'm also a sound engineer and was running my rig like a PA and suddenly I had a bunch of other options.  Of those though, I didn't need the parallel loop as I used a mixer for that (though using it now for the first time in my cut back 4RU rig), but the cab sim outs were perfect, and the gate very much needed for the crazy amount of gain the MP-2 has. I like the wah but I use it on auto triggered and not that much, good for hendrixy stuff.  Of the RTM, I've only ended up using the stereo master vol control for (up until later) the only expression pedal I had, which I find very useful with the way I play these days, basically turn up the vol on the same patch for lead.  As I'm sure you know, you can run the MP-2 quite simply and not bother with the bells and whistles, I've rarely futzed with the graphic eq. 

I get what you mean about the macros, however I've never tried them out and the RTM combinations in them I'm sure are worth trying, or the ADA dudes wouldn't have included them.  That's one thing I've always loved about ADA gear, it's well researched and thought out as in, this is what live guitar players (and bass players) want. 

The A/B A+B pedal I have is one I built modifying a Peavey (ch/rev) amp switch pedal.  So it selects 1 or other or both output jacks for the input to go to, real simple, just 2 switches and 3 jacks wired up.  I made it to select between Marshall 50 input or Rockman X100 input (or both  >:D ).  The X100 head phone out into 2 x 1/4" jack leads with voltage divider resistors (to drop the HP signal to guitar level), 1 to Marshall 50 (2nd input) the other to Marshall 100 Artist head. That was my lead boost prior to MP-1, when I first got the MP-1 I also fed it a signal and brought back the A/B outs into the X100 stereo input (TRS input for stereo in to the X100 to play along to..), until I got the B200s and Quadverb and mixer, sold the Marshall Artist to pay for it all.
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