ADA Depot Too - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Let us never forget our beloved founder - RIP Jurrie, we all miss you very much

Pages: 1 [2]   Go Down

Author Topic: Too much resonant bass????  (Read 7754 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

rabidgerry

  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1631
  • HEAVY METAL
    • Rabid Bitch of the North band facebook
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #15 on: Time Format »

Well you were right man.  I moved them apart and it sorted the issue.

I actually think the issue was so bad it was making me make mistakes.  It was so overwhelming I could feel it going through my body.  It definitely was agitating me to the point where I was making mistakes.

Anyways, I can live with it now, however I am a little disappointed that it doesn't couple up in a positive way.  The stacks both feel like I need to be in front of either one in order to hear them.  You know yourself guitar cabs are really directional but I just thought perhaps I could obtain wall of sound.  Oh well I should just be grateful I have sorted the issue.

I'm still going to pad the room out better though and get the bass of the floor.
Logged
"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GT5 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

rnolan

  • Administrator
  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4830
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #16 on: Time Format »

It's very difficult to give a good performance when you can't hear everything how you need/like it, I've done gigs where I got through because I new the songs note perfect, but you don't go off as well in those situations. I try to place my cab(s) so they open up on my ears (not my legs) or I end up too loud, but I also need to hear the rest of the band, and they me. So when I place us around a room, space, stage, I try to have it that we can all hear ourselves and each other (keeping in mind corners/floors that can couple and add boom/mud).
So just had an acoustic chat with my audio file mate... There's a sort of formula for this (bass boosts in rooms). So ideal (helpful) distances between things (to control (not antagonise) bass boost effects of rooms) a= distance from acoustic centre (measured from centre of cones) of cabs to floor (draw an X between the centre of the 4 12s of you L stack, is acoustic centre), b = acoustic centre to side wall, c = acoustic centre to rear wall. Ratio: a=1, b=1.5, c=2.25, but better is b=1.6 and c=2.4. It's dubbed the Allison effect, unequal path lengths.
Also to prevent box coupling, the distance between speaker cabs needs to be the same or more as the baffle size (the size of the cabs front (baffle)) When you stack 2 cabs, the baffle size doubles and give a bass boost depending on freq,~ 3db, 6 db, 12 db etc going down. To eq out (which is an option, start from 150hz and go down (depending how much eq control you have)). You could do a 150hz shelf, or if you have 3rd Octave, start with -3db at 150, -6 at 75hz, -12 at 37.5hz.
Padding the room and getting bass off the floor are good practical solutions.
Logged
Studio Rig: MP2/MB1 > Eurorack UB2442FX-Pro > TC M-One XL > Behringer Truths (with Truth Sub) / QUAD ESL 63s
Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s

rabidgerry

  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1631
  • HEAVY METAL
    • Rabid Bitch of the North band facebook
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #17 on: Time Format »

It's very difficult to give a good performance when you can't hear everything how you need/like it, I've done gigs where I got through because I new the songs note perfect, but you don't go off as well in those situations.

I've spent most of my entire gigging career in this situation.  It got even worse now I have to wear ear plugs to preserve my hearing (musicians ones obviously).  It makes gigging incredibly unsatisfying sometimes.
Logged
"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GT5 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

rnolan

  • Administrator
  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4830
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #18 on: Time Format »

Hey RG, Tried the ear things years ago  (sonic noise filters) , hate them (and I mean it (hate's a strong word! but appropriate here)), they just take away ALL the energy (for me anyway). They make playing at all unsatisfying, so I've sacrificed my ears, my hearing is still very articulate, but flattened a bit.
Logged
Studio Rig: MP2/MB1 > Eurorack UB2442FX-Pro > TC M-One XL > Behringer Truths (with Truth Sub) / QUAD ESL 63s
Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s

rabidgerry

  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1631
  • HEAVY METAL
    • Rabid Bitch of the North band facebook
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #19 on: Time Format »

Hey RG, Tried the ear things years ago  (sonic noise filters) , hate them (and I mean it (hate's a strong word! but appropriate here)), they just take away ALL the energy (for me anyway). They make playing at all unsatisfying, so I've sacrificed my ears, my hearing is still very articulate, but flattened a bit.

I can't afford to f*ck my hearing up, they are sensitive and I know they've been damaged so I have to preserve them as deafness actually runs in my family.  I blame the cymbals of drum kit entirely and possibly Motorhead  :metal:

Anyways, my big beef with them is they attenuate too much.  However, I found a set that finally reduces by a sensible amount -10db.  Most other ones are -18, -19, -20.  his is too much usually at gigs.  Practice I wear the -20db ones because we practice so loud that it all seems very loud even with -20db ear plugs in.  At gigs though the sound onstage is generally a million times lower, so if I need plugs in finally I can stick in a pair that will protect me but not lower the volume so much that I can't feel the things I'm playing and hear them in the right way.  Such a relief.  Don't want to sound like  a big wuss but I really want to be able to still mix music as audio production is hand in hand with me and the band now, I love DIY recording!!
Logged
"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GT5 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

rnolan

  • Administrator
  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4830
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #20 on: Time Format »

I haven't tried the modern ones, from what you are saying they may work for me (but I suspect it's too late  :facepalm: ). Cymbals killed my ears in a similar set up to your rehearsal room, it was so loud one jam that my hammer, anvil, and styrip disconnected and I was like floating (Marshall flat out cymbals pounding right next to me etc) in a basement (sound had no where to go).
BTW that whole hanging carpet thing will help, first 100mm off the wall, next 100mm again so 2 layers, will also soak up the top end from the cymbals (which is probably the most damaging)
Logged
Studio Rig: MP2/MB1 > Eurorack UB2442FX-Pro > TC M-One XL > Behringer Truths (with Truth Sub) / QUAD ESL 63s
Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s

rabidgerry

  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1631
  • HEAVY METAL
    • Rabid Bitch of the North band facebook
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #21 on: Time Format »

I haven't tried the modern ones, from what you are saying they may work for me (but I suspect it's too late  :facepalm: ). Cymbals killed my ears in a similar set up to your rehearsal room, it was so loud one jam that my hammer, anvil, and styrip disconnected and I was like floating (Marshall flat out cymbals pounding right next to me etc) in a basement (sound had no where to go).
BTW that whole hanging carpet thing will help, first 100mm off the wall, next 100mm again so 2 layers, will also soak up the top end from the cymbals (which is probably the most damaging)

I'd give them a go man, but may be your hearing i too far gone.  If you still think you hear pretty good and can do a good mix then perhaps you're ok.  I've told the boy's we're getting new rehearsal room decor lol.  Definatly standing in a garage, right next to drums is what helped mine on their way along with Motorhead.  Debbie Harry can no longer play onstage with drums as she has similar issues with cymbals.  Blondie's drummer playis with weird plexi glass deflectors surrounding his drum kit.  Crazy eh!!!  I totally understand why.

Wondeir why it's other people get screwed by cymbals and not drummers??  Mind you isn't Phil Colins screwed as well?  Perhaps that's a rumour??

It takes a while to get used to the plugs.  As I said, this new pair I got the reduce by -10db, they weren't enough for me at practice volume levels which are extreme (and it's only to compete with the drums I swear!!!)  However for gigs there is never anywehre near the same amount of volume onstage that I experience at band rehearsal so the -10db plugs are for gigs for me and should protect me just enough.  The -20db are for practice.  I only play with one amp at gigs, and never get to go full volume.  Practice I have two 150watt Crate PB's nearly at full volume, just to be at a good level with drums.  Bloody drummers!!!
Logged
"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GT5 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

rnolan

  • Administrator
  • Superhero Member
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4830
Re: Too much resonant bass????
« Reply #22 on: Time Format »

Hey RG, the good side is I still hear wirth good articulation (maybe years of training LOL).
Logged
Studio Rig: MP2/MB1 > Eurorack UB2442FX-Pro > TC M-One XL > Behringer Truths (with Truth Sub) / QUAD ESL 63s
Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s
Pages: 1 [2]   Go Up