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Author Topic: Power Conditioners  (Read 40442 times)

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MarshallJMP

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #15 on: Time Format »

Good work you have now converted me!

But this is the deal, you're buying it off me if I still have noise  :facepalm:

 :thumb-up:

Eyeing a few up on ebay, always after a bargain me  :whoohoo!:

Let us know if you want some help before buying!!!
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #16 on: Time Format »

actually yeah some people shouldn't be allowed on stages MJMP so I guess some  :poop:head could screw shit up on ya.

I'm actually broke after Christmas so I dunno when I can get one.  I see one on ebay at the mo.  It's a phonic which is the cheaper end of the market.  I have a 31 band stereo ok by them so I think their stuff is ok.  I'm only looking because if I snared it for 50quid it would at least give a starter PC and for all I know it's good.  The reviews of this model appear to say it's good.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Phonic-PPC8000E-Power-Conditioner-/141866500962?hash=item2107e70362:g:AywAAOSwJkJWhw4b


just found this as well  might be worth a last minute bid if I can it for next to nothing.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Samson-Powerbright-Distribution-And-Rack-Light/291649642995?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140122125356%26meid%3Dbdc6842b3d4344ecb454500760d31acf%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D321962452611
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

Systematic Chaos

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #17 on: Time Format »

AFAIK the Samson is just a power distributor/rack light whereas the Phonic has RFI/EMI filtering so I'd grab that one
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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Mesa Boogie MkIVb short head, ADA MP-1 v2, Fractal AxeFX II, Rocktron Velocity 150; Digitech GSP1101, DigiTech 2120Artist, Carvin Tube 100, Yamaha MFC10//
Ibanez RG550RF, Ibanez 540S-LPF DY, Ibanez RGR620TKS, Ibanez RGR620TPS, Ibanez RG550Ltd BK, Ibanez RG7620MSOL, Ibanez RGR465MCA, Ibanez RGR765RCB, Ibanez RG620QMSP, Ibanez RG1420FBHB, Ibanez RGT42MDX, 90s ESP M-II Dlx //
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #18 on: Time Format »

good spot my man, I just checked that out there now.  Wonder if anymore bargains are knocking about on there.  I see an ART 4x4 for about 63quid.  Might be an alternative if the Phonic falls through.
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

Systematic Chaos

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #19 on: Time Format »

Must be the PB 4x4 Pro then.... The "normal" PB 4x4 goes for 49$ new...
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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Mesa Boogie MkIVb short head, ADA MP-1 v2, Fractal AxeFX II, Rocktron Velocity 150; Digitech GSP1101, DigiTech 2120Artist, Carvin Tube 100, Yamaha MFC10//
Ibanez RG550RF, Ibanez 540S-LPF DY, Ibanez RGR620TKS, Ibanez RGR620TPS, Ibanez RG550Ltd BK, Ibanez RG7620MSOL, Ibanez RGR465MCA, Ibanez RGR765RCB, Ibanez RG620QMSP, Ibanez RG1420FBHB, Ibanez RGT42MDX, 90s ESP M-II Dlx //
DiMarzio CrunchLab/ToneZone/Gravity Storm/Liquifire/AirNorton/PAF Pro/HfH/ibzUSA F Series pups

Kim

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #20 on: Time Format »

Lets say you have a gig and some idiot switched the neutral and line and you plug in your gear at 380Vac....

I'm sure it would but why would anyone do this?

I believe what MarshallJMP is talking about here is how the venue (or even your house or studio) outlets/circuits are actually wired.  You can't assume that everyone has their stuff wired by someone certified to do that and have it up to the proper code and regulations even though it may be the law.  I've worked as a Maintenance Tech for a few places in the past, and I'm here to tell ya.....I've seen some things, man.   Matter of fact, my current and past two residences all needed some electrical wiring re-done when I moved in because I learned to just check that stuff automatically.  Some people think that because the outlet is AC, that the Neutral and Line are interchangeable with each other and just wire all their outlets willy nilly right down the entire circuit.  >:(

That said, I haven't yet played a venue that featured shit wiring but I will never chance plugging my gear in without a Power conditioner...

So long as the guitar gets improved I don't care about stupid bass and vocals  :thumb-up:

 :lol:  Careful, those might be fightin' words.   lol
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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RIG OF FIRE:  ADA MP-2, Rocktron Xpression, Peavey Classic 60/60, Gator pedalboard, Rolls MidiBuddy, Dunlop 95Q wah.
Mellotron/organ section:  EHX Mel9, EHX C9, Saturnworks A/B switch, Vox V860 volume, Crate Powerblock.
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HOME/STUDIO/COMBOS/STUFF:  Peavey JSX halfstack, Crate G60XL, Saturnworks Saturn Fuzz,  EHX Soul Food, ProCo Rat, Ibanez Smashbox, Saturnworks buffered splitter, Morley Tremonti wah, Peavey PV6, Korg DTR-1000, ADA MPC.
GUITARS:  Jackson KE3-DiMarzio Breed/PAF Pro, Jackson KE3-DiMarzio Breed/PAF Pro, Silvertone P-bass, '70s Gretsch Dorado acoustic.
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #21 on: Time Format »

SC $49?  Where you see that?

I got these guys doing it cheapest I seen

https://www.bax-shop.co.uk/19-inch-power-strip/art-pb4x4-power-base-power-distribution-unit-and-stabiliser?gclid=CJXitLf2k8oCFYu4Gwodl2sIwg

probably more after shipping.


HI Kim,

I'm still confused as to the switching of negative and line wires.  It may be different in America, but no one opens up appliances in the UK and switches the wires in the plug.  When people buy stuff they leave it as it is....well the plugs anyways.

Can you describe exactly what you mean because the idea someone would switch the sires in the plugs is madness to me because it will just blow up, which is why no one would do such a thing in the UK.  Is there some point that people would do that in the states?
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

Kim

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #22 on: Time Format »

I'm still confused as to the switching of negative and line wires.  It may be different in America, but no one opens up appliances in the UK and switches the wires in the plug.  When people buy stuff they leave it as it is....well the plugs anyways.

Can you describe exactly what you mean because the idea someone would switch the sires in the plugs is madness to me because it will just blow up, which is why no one would do such a thing in the UK.  Is there some point that people would do that in the states?

The actual wall receptacle that you would plug your gear into may not be wired right.  The prime example would be that the owner of the property might NOT want to hire a qualified electrician to do the work, whether it be just adding a circuit or two to existing property or starting from go with a newly built property.  The mindset usually is "I can save a lot of money by doing it myself" and "it's only 3 wires and one of them is Ground (Earth) and the other two go wherever; no big deal nobody will know"  and then usually followed by "code schmode"...  It happens here a lot.  :dunno:
« Last Edit: Time Format by Systematic Chaos »
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RIG OF FIRE:  ADA MP-2, Rocktron Xpression, Peavey Classic 60/60, Gator pedalboard, Rolls MidiBuddy, Dunlop 95Q wah.
Mellotron/organ section:  EHX Mel9, EHX C9, Saturnworks A/B switch, Vox V860 volume, Crate Powerblock.
Three 4x12 cabs:  all custom wired for both 2x12 guitar and 2x12 Mel9. UPDATED DIAGRAMS
HOME/STUDIO/COMBOS/STUFF:  Peavey JSX halfstack, Crate G60XL, Saturnworks Saturn Fuzz,  EHX Soul Food, ProCo Rat, Ibanez Smashbox, Saturnworks buffered splitter, Morley Tremonti wah, Peavey PV6, Korg DTR-1000, ADA MPC.
GUITARS:  Jackson KE3-DiMarzio Breed/PAF Pro, Jackson KE3-DiMarzio Breed/PAF Pro, Silvertone P-bass, '70s Gretsch Dorado acoustic.
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #23 on: Time Format »

Ok I see what you mean.

It doesn't happen here a lot lol which is why I was like "why would anyne do that?".

Apart from me sturggling with the concept of stupid idiots wiring shit up badly, at least I have been convinved to get a PC, so I really hope it changes things for me.  I may have suffered from garbage from electrical supply all these years and not realised and just thought I had noisey gear of some sorts or that it was the location I was in that had shit electric supply and I had to put up with it, like in our rehearsal room.  I noticed in some venues it's not too bad and other is would be, but I didn't realise the fact that a million things are all plugged in at the same time that would even affect it so fingers crossed the PC will change things for me.

The obvious protection element of a PC will of course be a plus as well but the noise thing will be the biggest incentive for me personally.
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

MarshallJMP

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #24 on: Time Format »

What i mean is when you have a 3 phase net you get get 380V between the line voltages and 220V between neutral and line (when you have a 220/380V grid),if someone switches the neutral wire with a line wire you will get 380V instead of 220V on one of the connections.

Also a bad connection in the neutral wire can cause voltage fluctuations between line and neutral where depending on the load one phase can have 180V and on another you can get 260V or more.This happends a lot.Now the undervoltage won't hurt anything but the overvoltage ...

Now on the other hand,let's say you have an open air gig and everything has to be build from scratch it's not unlikely that a mixup in the wiring can happen,have seen it before.

This is the reason i bought a furman power conditioner series II,these don't work with VDR's anymore but they have an active sensing circuit that measures the incomming voltage,and if it's too high it will go into protect mode and won't switch on the outputs that go to your gear.I find this a lot safer then the VDR's where you will have to hope that the internal fuse will blow on time when the VDR protection comes in.But usually this is not case.And afterwards you need to replace all the VDR's in the PC.And they blow a lot,have replaced these a lot back in the days.

So it's not only EMI/RFI suppression that is important but also the level of protection.So it's better to invest 200 euro in a good device that protects your gear then paying a lot more when something goes wrong at a gig or even at your home.

Furman is the world leader when it comes to PC's.They are not cheap but they are just the best you can get.
« Last Edit: Time Format by MarshallJMP »
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #25 on: Time Format »

From what I have been reading on the devices I have been looking at they all seem to have the trip switch that will turn the unit off or beak the circuit when it senses something wrong.  Some have a visual meter guage

Another answer to the "what of someone does this" scenarios which in the UK is a totally unlikely is...............

music insurance which I have  :thumb-up:  Doesn't cost that much to get protected all over europe at home or away if something does get damaged I can get compensated if something randomly blows up.

For me MJMP the main attraction of PC is the cleaning aspect.  I'm really not worried about gear blowing, although I take on board your advice so I'm not snubbing ya man.  I'm getting one in some shape or form so I will be protected, just may not be a furman.  Not yet anyway.
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

MarshallJMP

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #26 on: Time Format »

Ok i hear you  :thumb-up:  Just pointing out the things that can go wrong based on my experience as a tech and at work.

The trip switch is just a fuse which only trips if the current is too high.It doesn't sense a higher then normal voltage.

Insurrance,well they are always happy to collect money but as soon as something goes wrong and they need to pay out they always find some small print to escape paying.Or you have drop some amount etc...

Now furman also has different "level" conditioners going from really cheap to freaking expensive.

http://ehomerecordingstudio.com/power-conditioner-reviews/
« Last Edit: Time Format by MarshallJMP »
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rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #27 on: Time Format »

I've saw furman at like £2000

what level are you using?  As in what model and around what price.  I saw a series 2 like you mention for around £100 the other day.
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"

Systematic Chaos

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #28 on: Time Format »

I guess the 2k£ one is a Voltage Regulator on top of being a Power Conditioner.
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=P-6900-ARE

I'm using the predecessor of this one:
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-PLUSCE

This would be the pro one (minus volatge regulator feature):
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-PRODMCE

This one gets the job done as well:
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-8CE
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Mesa Boogie MkIVb short head, ADA MP-1 v2, Fractal AxeFX II, Rocktron Velocity 150; Digitech GSP1101, DigiTech 2120Artist, Carvin Tube 100, Yamaha MFC10//
Ibanez RG550RF, Ibanez 540S-LPF DY, Ibanez RGR620TKS, Ibanez RGR620TPS, Ibanez RG550Ltd BK, Ibanez RG7620MSOL, Ibanez RGR465MCA, Ibanez RGR765RCB, Ibanez RG620QMSP, Ibanez RG1420FBHB, Ibanez RGT42MDX, 90s ESP M-II Dlx //
DiMarzio CrunchLab/ToneZone/Gravity Storm/Liquifire/AirNorton/PAF Pro/HfH/ibzUSA F Series pups

rabidgerry

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Re: Power Conditioners
« Reply #29 on: Time Format »

I guess the 2k£ one is a Voltage Regulator on top of being a Power Conditioner.
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=P-6900-ARE

I'm using the predecessor of this one:
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-PLUSCE

This would be the pro one (minus volatge regulator feature):
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-PRODMCE

This one gets the job done as well:
http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?div=03&id=PL-8CE

could not afford even the basic one right now


http://www.thomann.de/gb/furman_pl8_ce.htm

what about this one?

http://www.thomann.de/gb/furman_m10lx_e.htm
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"whadda ya want? we want Heavy Metal"

Guitars:1986 Westone Dimension IV, 1989 Korean Squier Fat Strat Silver Series, 1998 Korean Squier Fat Strat, MIM Fender Fat Strat - FR, Squier Stagemaster Deluxe - Thru Neck x 2, Squier Stagemaster 22 Fret - 1st Gen, 1999 Squier Showmaster - Anniversary Edition, Squier Showmaster, Tokai FV40 Flying V

Effects:  Ada Mp1, Peavey Rockmaster, Boss GX700 Boss SX700 * Amps:   Rocktron Velocity 300 - Harley Benton GPA400
Cabs: 4 x Bugera 2 x 12"
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