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Miscellaneous => Rants & Raves => Topic started by: Dante on January 21, 2017, 10:10:14 AM

Title: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 21, 2017, 10:10:14 AM
I love when people don't give something a chance because it doesn't have a high priced brand name on it. For example, I play mid-range guitars most of the time, almost exclusively Ibanez, because I can get them for cheap and the necks play like butter. What cracks me up is people comment on my tone as if it's the guitar that is responsible for it "you sure got some nice tones outta that guitar" never giving the rack gear credit.

Another example was when I bought my H&K cabinet from a "boogie" guy. Here's how it went:

He says, "I'm kind of a Boogie purist, nothing else will do". He had a nice Mark V head, and a Lonestar combo in his living room.

I went on to explain that I have a DC-5, so I know what you're talking about, but I can easily get those tones out of my old ADA preamp.

He looked at me like I was lying or crazy, or both. Totally skeptical.

So, I plugged my rack into the H&K cab and pulled up my "metal" patch (super scooped mids). I could tell right away he was surprised by the way he came around the front of the rig to get a better look, but he was trying really hard not to let on.

He asked if I had modified the preamp. Nope.

He asked how many tubes were in there. Two, I said.

What about the power amp? It's got a couple 12ax7s in it, but it's kind of a hybrid power amp (MT-200).

He says...well, it sounds good, but I'll keep my Boogies.

Good for you, I said. (knowing that I have a Boogie, a Fender, and a hot rodded Marshall in my rack at the push of a button) Thanks for the cabinet, have a nice day.

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 21, 2017, 02:50:09 PM
I know a lot of worst people.

I spent so much time discussing about obvious things and I've lost so much time whit some idiots that, at the end, I gave up.
Keep up your bullshit and leave me alone.

There is people who's absolutely convinced that wax potting a pickup will make it sound different.  :facepalm:
Some others are sure the tailpiece's studs made of steel instead of any other metal alloy can actually change the overall tone of a Les Paul.  :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
When you try to explain why this is total bullshit from electrical, electromagnetic and physical points of view, they answer "ok, but my ears tell me something different".
The problem are not your ears but what should be among them and that's missing: a brain.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 22, 2017, 05:06:14 AM
Hey Max, come on, wax potting a PU will make it sound different, it will be a heap less microphonic and not make crazy horrible noises as much LoL.  I do take your point though.
@RG you've done a bit of the potting thing, what do you recon ? IIRC from some of your (very old) posts it's a bit of an art.

Brass tail piece and studs will give a bit more sustain, although the string break angle over the saddles (and nut) (supported by good physics  :thumb-up: ) makes the most difference.

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Rawk777 on January 22, 2017, 07:01:04 AM
I have an Epiphone Les Paul Tribute Plus that have a pair of Gibson USA '57 Classic in iit. This guitar had a lot of feedback issues, even at low volume. Really unpleasant feedback issues. Since I wax potted it, it plays like a charm. Did the tone change after wax potting it? Maybe... it's a bit less bright, it's hard to say, but now it's playable :p
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 22, 2017, 07:21:23 AM
Some others are sure the tailpiece's studs made of steel instead of any other metal alloy can actually change the overall tone of a Les Paul.  :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
When you try to explain why this is total bullshit from electrical, electromagnetic and physical points of view, they answer "ok, but my ears tell me something different".
The problem are not your ears but what should be among them and that's missing: a brain.

This is pretty funny, thanks  :lol:

FWIW, I have several guitars with chrome hardware and a matching one with brass. I can tell no difference. If one of those bridges is made of crappy pot metal, of course a brass one would sound better. Just from a sustain perspective. 
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 22, 2017, 08:06:29 AM
 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Don't get me wrong, guys.
I had my personal experience with pickups wax potting.
I owned a couple of MIJ Fernandes/Burny Les Pauls from the '80s, one of them with original VH-1 pickups.
Those guitars were awesome and VH-1 pickups are more than decent ones, good old LP tones...but they're not wax potted.
I've always been a sort of "good amount of gain" guy...I love hard rock, metal, heavy stuff...last band I played with was a Kiss tribute band...so I think you can figure out the sounds I like more.
Well...with VH-1 pickups I had those tones but also a lot of noise and feedback, so I made them wax potted.
Every feedback issue was fixed and the pickups tone was 100% untouched...and I know that because I could compare the situation before and after wax potting.  :banana:

With studs is the same...they can modify something about sustain, maybe...but your guitar's overall tone would remain the same.
I've owned 4-5 LPs in the past years (including a Custom Shop Goldtop '54 Reissue with P-90s) and I was used to change everything but wood...  :lol:
I used alu tailpieces, steel studs, wraparounds and stuff so on...Today I'm not sure anymore this could change things so much that it worth the price you pay to aftermarket.
I own a Standard 2013 Gibson SG with '57 pickups (very good Gibson pickups! Factory wax potted, as far as I know. The best to me!) where I didn't change a screw...when I bought her, I compared with a Custom Shop Reissue SG with Custombuckers, alu tailpiece and ABR-1 bridge...Custombuckers where just more midrangy and I loved '57s more...after that, the guitar is an SG...
What Gibson seems not able anymore to do is a good f**king NUT.
They use corian everywhere and that makes more difference: I swapped original nut wit a TUSQ with correct strings spacing and this fixed some tuning and tone issues (higher strings where a little weak).
And no more wraparound: just lifted the tailpiece a litte to get correct strings angle...
That guitar KILLS! 100% Angus tone.   :metal:

Now I'm going to receive a very kind gift from a friend: a 199x Studio Les Paul.
That guitar was owned by her father who passed away last December and she wants me to keep that guitar.
I will and I will not modify anything there: I bet that Les Paul will have perfect tones!


By the way, as I wrote, I'm outside this kind of discussion since many years and I do not want to start again here.
What I want to point out is that's a matter of approach: if someone has something to suggest you, give him/her a chance...and power off what your ears keep repeating.  :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've a very good friend...we're friends since very long time now (more than 25 years for sure) and he's a very talented guitar player and a very good guy.
Is also a GAS guy as we are...but, coming to such arguments, he's more like "I don't understand about physics or electronic, but my ears..."......... GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR.................. :nono: :nono: :nono:
One of these days, I will cut his ears off!  :wave:

 :banana-dance: :banana-dance: :banana-dance:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 22, 2017, 10:46:04 AM
+1 on Burney guitars  :thumb-up:  If you find one, or an Orville, get it, you won't be disappointed.

Also, Gibson is not exclusive in using crappy nut material. I have replaced all of mine with TUSQ nuts (except for the brass nut, of course).
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 22, 2017, 01:01:28 PM
+1 on Burney guitars  :thumb-up:  If you find one, or an Orville, get it, you won't be disappointed.

Also, Gibson is not exclusive in using crappy nut material. I have replaced all of mine with TUSQ nuts (except for the brass nut, of course).

Amen, mate.  :bow:

MIJ guitars are still awesome instruments.
Greco, Aria, Yamaha, Fernandes, Tokai, Orville or first Epiphone, old Squiers...all the Fuji-Gen made guitars worth a try.

About TUSQ...it's the best material to build perfect nuts!  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 23, 2017, 03:22:33 AM
Hey Max, I put Gibson 57 re-issues in my epiphone SG, I love them, great PUs.  I liked the epiphone PUs but they were a bit microphonic.  I tried the standard swap of SD JB Bridge and SD Alnico neck, they were ok, but nothing special, didn't float my boat.  Then went for the 57s  :whoohoo!: . expensive here though $300 AUD a piece..  My custom shop (2006) JPLP has a 59 PAF in the neck (nice PU mmmm), and a jimmy page burst bucker in the bridge (it's ok, I'd rather a 57 but do I modify such a collectable  :dunno: ).

When you get the LP pls post pics  :thumb-up: , nice gift (and IMHO to the right person , someone who will play and cherish it).
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 23, 2017, 04:48:24 AM
Hey RN, yeah I have wax potted pickups.  Now I honestly cannot say I noticed much difference tonally, but of course it made a difference in regards to microphonics.

I've potted and repotted pickups.

In regards to the original subject of lesser branded equipment/intruments.  Well I'm an example of someone who truly doesn't believe a £1500 guitar is going to be better than a £250 guitar with some upgrades.  The difference in price certainly does not justify the difference (if any) sound differences.

All my guitars (well a lot) are Squiers.  And even better than that they were all second hand so even cheaper again.  I know these guitars are good quality and I know a few upgrades later puts them in an even better category.

Something crazy I have even found though is that some of the steel upgrades I have made to my guitars have not always been better sonically.  And I decided with one guitar I own (yes the pink one) to leave it with it's original small sustain block.  Why?  Because it sounds just the way I want it and the change it has made to some of my other guitars I'm not sure I actually want to happen with this guitar so there ya go!!  Uprgrades might not actually make your guitar better either.


PS had my hands on a Godin strat the other week.  Fixing a pot on it for a friend.  As far as I know it cost more than some of my axes, yet it felt (to me anyways), like a cheapo piece of crap.  My Chinese, and Korean guitars felt a lot more solid and durable and just dam right better quality.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 23, 2017, 05:07:22 AM
Hey RN, yeah I have wax potted pickups.  Now I honestly cannot say I noticed much difference tonally, but of course it made a difference in regards to microphonics.

I've potted and repotted pickups.

In regards to the original subject of lesser branded equipment/intruments.  Well I'm an example of someone who truly doesn't believe a £1500 guitar is going to be better than a £250 guitar with some upgrades.  The difference in price certainly does not justify the difference (if any) sound differences.

All my guitars (well a lot) are Squiers.  And even better than that they were all second hand so even cheaper again.  I know these guitars are good quality and I know a few upgrades later puts them in an even better category.

Something crazy I have even found though is that some of the steel upgrades I have made to my guitars have not always been better sonically.  And I decided with one guitar I own (yes the pink one) to leave it with it's original small sustain block.  Why?  Because it sounds just the way I want it and the change it has made to some of my other guitars I'm not sure I actually want to happen with this guitar so there ya go!!  Uprgrades might not actually make your guitar better either.


PS had my hands on a Godin strat the other week.  Fixing a pot on it for a friend.  As far as I know it cost more than some of my axes, yet it felt (to me anyways), like a cheapo piece of crap.  My Chinese, and Korean guitars felt a lot more solid and durable and just dam right better quality.

 :bow: :bow: :bow:

I've a chinese Modern Player Strat that makes a good job.
I love that guitar.
With stock pickups and electronic, is very good (I suspect PUs are non branded Tonerider stuff....).
I did an upgrade with some PUs I bought from StewMac (not expensive stuff) and the guitar overall tone improved.
Great neck and fingerboard.
A very good Strat with more quality than many MIM Strats sold at a double price.

I own different guitars...one of them is an over the top 1987 PRS Custom, 100% original (the only valuable guitar I own, even if I love them all!)....so I can do comparison among different instruments and I agree with you.

About '57 Classic pickups...I remembered right, they are wax potted already:

http://store.gibson.com/57-classic-pickup/

Maybe early 2-wires models were not?  :dunno:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 23, 2017, 05:41:05 AM
I do upgrade my pickups also, mostly because I do not get the balls and guts I need from the standard pups that come supplied with the likes of my Squiers.  If I played country music or something else, I'd probably have stuck with the stock pups.

Also I generally use a Dimarzio Super D also because that is an element to my sound that I want to here specifically (even anyone can actually tell.....and they probably cannot).

I seem to recall another thread on guitars on here where I perhaps ranted a little about big brand axes and gear and how I wasn't so crazy about the price justification etc etc and somebody took exception to it and called my attitude bad lol and tried to make an example of me   :facepalm:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 23, 2017, 06:49:41 AM
(and somebody took exception to it and called my attitude bad lol and tried to make an example of me)
Well I hope that wasn't me  :facepalm: , I have a bunch of "enhanced" cheaper guitars. But I would say buying the JPLP and then the Alembic SC Brown bass though reignited in me the difference between (some) very expensive instruments and others.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 23, 2017, 06:59:27 AM
(and somebody took exception to it and called my attitude bad lol and tried to make an example of me)
Well I hope that wasn't me  :facepalm: , I have a bunch of "enhanced" cheaper guitars. But I would say buying the JPLP and then the Alembic SC Brown bass though reignited in me the difference between (some) very expensive instruments and others.

Yes, I agree...but sometimes a good setup, made as it should be done, could make more miracles than 1500-2000 dollars.  :green-banana-smiley-emoticon:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 23, 2017, 07:02:17 AM
Absolutely  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 23, 2017, 07:23:10 AM
lol Richard it wasn't you  :lol:

My most Expensive guitar is a Westone Dimension Iv.  Now I do not know how much this guitar cost back in 1985, but I know now that it's arounf £400-500 if found in good condition because they are hard to find in good nick.

I'd love it if I knew someone who could repair cracks in paint work.  My Dimension Iv despite being in great condition has a few blemishes.

Another guitar that I bought which was about £450 was my mexican fat strat with FR trem.  Funnily enough I haven't played that guitar in a long time.

The guitars I play most are the cheaper ones some of which retailed new at about £200-£250.  Buy I bought them second hand for like £80-£110 somewhere in that range!
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 23, 2017, 08:02:55 AM
The guitars I play most are the cheaper ones some of which retailed new at about £200-£250.  Buy I bought them second hand for like £80-£110 somewhere in that range!

I serviced a VIG Screech guitar of a friend, some months ago...
It's a cheap copy of an ESP KH-II...
Well...it's cheap, ok....but it's a very good, solid and reliable guitar.
He payed something like 200 euro for that guitar (new and shipped)...put there a couple of EMG pickup and EMG electronics...and it's almost perfect.
I just would mount a better FR bridge there....

Look at this one:

http://www.mercatinomusicale.com/mm/a_vgs-vig-select-screech-spalted-maple-natural-spedizione-inclusa_id1522166.html (http://www.mercatinomusicale.com/mm/a_vgs-vig-select-screech-spalted-maple-natural-spedizione-inclusa_id1522166.html)
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 23, 2017, 08:45:46 AM
+1 on Fujigen guitars, those are my pricey ones, I have 4-5 of them. All Ibanez.

I also share RGs sentiment on Squires and Korean models. Just upgrade some bits and you have a very nice guitar. My Vee is an Epiphone Korina model that I have gutted (upgraded all electronics, PUs & the nut). That thing sings like my real Korina Explorer for a fraction of the cost, and I don't worry about it walking away at a gig. I don't take the Explorer out of the house much. It has too much sentimental value and it's my only Gibby

Here's a quick rundown of some of the prices I've paid:

Epiphone Korina V = $350 w/hardshell case
Ibanez SAS36FM = $150 (this is my Strat, a set-neck Korean model with an unknown HOT pu in the bridge, HSS config.)
Ibanez AS83 = $400 (came with SD Jazz/JB setup and has 'that tone' by which all others are compared, and it's Chinese!)
Ibanez AR200 Gold Top = $350 w/hardshell case (I've done every upgrade I can to this one, it's also Korean)

Some people get bent outta shape about cheap construction, like scarf joints. I don't see why, that damn thing is still made of WOOD

UPDATE: here are some pix of the aforementioned guitars, because
 :postpics:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 23, 2017, 08:50:39 AM
Some people get bent outta shape about cheap construction, like scarf joints. I don't see why, that damn thing is still made of WOOD

If properly glued, a scarf neck joint is solid rock.
And a one piece neck-headstock can easily break as well, if the guitar falls down in the worst way.

Furthermore, a scarf joint could be more reliable...due to its flexibility Vs. rigidity of a one piece neck.

I remember an old Jackson Soloist a friend o' mine owned (before Fender era) and it had a scarf headstock joint...
It was an expensive and solid guitar and Grover Jackson is a guy who definitely knows how to build a solid guitar.

If 1+1 = 2...  :banana-upsidedown:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 23, 2017, 09:21:49 AM
BTW I got that Westone Dimension IV from America, so I PAID a hefty import tax on that thing.  That's how much I wanted it.  I got the original case and whammy bar also which made it more of  find.

Talking about the Chinese made stuff............looks like Big Donald T is hoping bring an end to the cheap exported goods from far east.  You guy's in the States need to buy up the cheapo guitars quick before he shuts it all down and builds that wall he keep talking about.  :o


Sorry if I broke any rules on politics  ;D

Actually on a serious note, that might screw a lot of US guitar companies who use cheap foreign labour to have stuff manufactured, Fender and nearly everyone has something going out there in the far east.  Even Celestion (yes their british but you know what I mean) has some models made there now including the Vintage 30s's.

I'll post some photos guys  :thumb-up:  so long as I aint banned from mentioning Donald, no offence meant buy it.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 23, 2017, 09:34:08 AM
I'll post some photos guys  :thumb-up:  so long as I aint banned from mentioning Donald, no offence meant buy it.

No worries bro, just don't start any political fights and we're all good  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 23, 2017, 11:39:43 AM
No, no fights, of course my man.  Just curious as to how imports from the East will be affected going into America?
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 23, 2017, 12:34:46 PM
I'm curious about lots of things that may change, like if I have medical insurance anymore. Whoops....there I go with a political comment  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Systematic Chaos on January 23, 2017, 04:18:18 PM
... Just curious as to how imports [...] will be affected ...

What´s more interesting is how imports/exports are now affected due to the CITES II regulations in force affective Jan 2017 which concerns all musical instruments that contain rosewood (all types).
I been following NAMM on YT and that was one of the core topics omnipresent...

Back On-Topic:
I guess we have to distinguish between Brand-Snobbery and Tone-Snobbery....
I´m personally also more on the practical side of things. If it sounds and feels good to me I don´t give flying %$§& what brand is stamped on there.
I´ve come back as of recently to Ibanez mainly because it feels best to me when playing... I don´t care too much about their actual offerings (Prestige, J-Custom,....), the "golden MIJ years" ('87-2002) are the ones I´m after.
These can be found for little coin (see my latest 3 NGD threads).
I also have an Indo-made that´s not bad at all as well as a Korean Cort (see my "Pimp my Cheapo" thread).
The most expensive guitars I ever bought were an ESP Skulls & Snakes (bought in the ESP Custom shop for 4.800 Deutsch Marks in the early 90s) and a Fender Richie Sambora Signature Strat (HSS Floyd Model) for 3.200 Deutsch Marks.
These are both long gone but I hunted down an RG550Ltd that I had around the same time...get the point?!

I am a Brand Snob to a certain extent in terms of Pickups...but that's only because I´ve the specific tonal characteristics I´m looking for (which are an integral part of 'my tone') in DiMarzio pups...it´s something about the whole EQing and tonal curve and feel...hard to explain.
But like RG and his Super Ds it´s a non-negotiable component.

With all the resources in aftermarket replacement parts and NOS stuff, you can mod almost any cheapo to awesome end-result-specs.

 
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on January 24, 2017, 02:02:18 AM
Well Dante, that is a lot more important I guess than guitars coming in to US from abroad.  I hope things work out over there.

SC raises some interesting points also.

And yes back to the topic.  I have no real issue with more expensive guitars and expensive equipment, I don't really have reverse snobbery.  I just wouldn't spend £1000 on a guitar when I could get a great guitar for a quarter of the price.  Also I love modifying a guitar, making it my own.

But I have experienced those people who look down their noses (the snobs) at say my cheapo Squiers.  They're out there.  The fact I never come across anyone else with guitars as cheap as mine when playing gigs kind of says a lot to me though.  Some people just can't ignore the brand/expense status, even if they know themselves you can get a good instrument for less, it's a fear of what others will think type thing I guess.

I like that no one else uses the same axes as me though, sets me apart.  People always come up to me and go "nice guitar man, what is it?"  Then their like "Squier.......................jeeeez man I would neve rhave known".

Have to laugh at that  :lol:

Now I dunno if my axes sound good in general but I like them so this is the important thing I guess.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 24, 2017, 02:16:03 AM
I'm in the same mood, guys.

I play guitar since 33-34 years now and I owned 3 expensive guitars in all this time: a Custom Shop Les Paul '54 Ri that's gone for a Masterbuilt Strat that's gone for my 1987 Custom PRS (I still own it and I will for very long time, I hope...).
Then I owned and own other instruments, some of them are cheap...but with a good setup and some customization, they can be great guitars.
Chinese Squiers or Indonesian Ibbys are a very good base to start from, no doubts.

I bought for a few money a '90s MIJ Squier Strat neck and a MIJ Strat body with dings and marks.
Both they have aged in a nice way.
I'm using that stuff to assemble a customized HSS Strat...and I already know it will be a great guitar: I feel it from the neck and body.
Look attached picture...

I remember, some years ago when I owned my beloved MIJ Les Pauls, a lot of people spending a lot of money to buy Historic Les Pauls and then changing everything there but the wood or doing very expensive refins and makeovers.
I was just telling them "Hey guys, consider some MIJ Les Pauls to do some jobs..."....I let you imagine comments by yourself.
After some years and after I left those places since a while, that people had sold their expensive Les Pauls....and came to...Greco MIJ guitars.  :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 24, 2017, 04:10:35 AM
Squire Strat (initially $180 AUD) worth a bit more now though LoL
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 24, 2017, 04:55:18 AM
Very nice Strat, Rich!  :thumb-up:

Hey....did I see 3 MP-2s and a TC M-One on background???  :banana-trip:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Systematic Chaos on January 24, 2017, 05:12:59 AM
Korean Cort G250FT HSS Strat...70€ off eBay.
Already came with a Wilkinson VS100 Trem.
Upgraded the Pups with DiMarzio Virtual Hot PAF bridge and Injector Middle/Neck pups and a GraphTech Tusq Nut.
One serious player now....
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af41/MagnusBausW/7275503B-B13B-45B2-867F-FCF8D083190E_zpsd2qzlbr4.jpg)
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af41/MagnusBausW/E6245DC7-48E9-42BC-BAE0-80D3394F9F3F_zps8yooo1xh.jpg)
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af41/MagnusBausW/A3EEAD4B-76D7-4D66-9CB3-81263ADDEBCD_zpsqnncksye.jpg)
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af41/MagnusBausW/92971BC7-4E29-439F-9FD5-F02680258483_zpszlwdzueh.jpg)
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on January 24, 2017, 05:27:24 AM
 :whoohoo!: :whoohoo!: :whoohoo!:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on January 24, 2017, 08:27:12 AM
SC: that is a LOVELY guitar (and I'm pretty sure I know which PUs are in there ;) )
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on January 24, 2017, 11:12:16 PM
Very nice Strat, Rich!  :thumb-up: Hey....did I see 3 MP-2s and a TC M-One on background???  :banana-trip:
Thanks Max, the strat came up quite well, new black chrome gotohs, graphtech nut, wilkinson trem, super switch, push/pull pots, SD hotrails and lill 59.
Yes  >:D :facepalm: 3 MP2s (the 4th is in my live rack), and I really like the TCMOne (also a TLAaudio Ivory 5001 hybrid tube 4 ch preamp, a Focusrite Platunum Penta stereo compressor and a Digi002). Although that rack now has only 1 MP-2 and 1 MB-1 and soon I'll probably put the working MP-1 in there as well. I need a 240v Classic to round it out.

@SC, nice guitar  :thumb-up: :whoohoo!:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 13, 2017, 06:20:43 AM
Here is one of my non £1000 guitars.  New it may have been about £300 since these were upmarket Squiers, but I got it for about £100 I think.

It's pink and a bit "Motley Crue" but there is an irony to me having this guitar and playing it live that people find amusing and because it sounds good it does not matter that it's the most silly colour of all time.  Ironic because I am not an advocate of "Glam" or "Hair" metal.

These photos do not do it justice but I will take some better ones.  I love the feel and playability of this guitar.  I put a dimarzio Super D in there also.  I have a Super Distortion 2 for the neck but I aint installed it yet.  I think I upgraded the tone cap to an orange drop as well.  Can't remember.


(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/463c75ac-8928-4d49-807e-262c781d2547.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/463c75ac-8928-4d49-807e-262c781d2547.jpg.html)

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/a6b296ff-727d-4dc5-ae94-ab96e187391d.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/a6b296ff-727d-4dc5-ae94-ab96e187391d.jpg.html)

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/070a4219-9b89-4eba-8a92-ef981f64c372.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/070a4219-9b89-4eba-8a92-ef981f64c372.jpg.html)

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/8ac52cb5-6c3a-4bf4-869d-8c93ea9cce38.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/8ac52cb5-6c3a-4bf4-869d-8c93ea9cce38.jpg.html)

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/Squier%20Showmaster%20-%2020th%20Anni%203.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/Squier%20Showmaster%20-%2020th%20Anni%203.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Kim on February 13, 2017, 07:02:15 PM
I'd totally rock out with that guitar, too RG.   :thumb-up:   I wouldn't care if it's pink or not.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on February 13, 2017, 07:57:07 PM
I'd totally rock out with that guitar, too RG.   :thumb-up:   I wouldn't care if it's pink or not.

 :thumb-up:

I'd probably add a Hello Kitty sticker, but would have NO problem rockin' that axe
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on February 13, 2017, 11:06:16 PM
Very nice guitar SG  :thumb-up: :whoohoo!:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 14, 2017, 01:59:45 AM
I'd totally rock out with that guitar, too RG.   :thumb-up:   I wouldn't care if it's pink or not.

 :thumb-up:

I'd probably add a Hello Kitty sticker, but would have NO problem rockin' that axe

 :lol:  No no stickers ruining nice guitars  :thumb-up:

If I  did though I'd put a He-Man Masters of the Universe sticker on there, but it would probably look shit hahaha

Yeah the guitar is pink, and not a majorly expensive guitar, and yet it's definitely a quality instrument and really, really has something I very much love about playing it. And yes....................made in China.  It doesn't look to crazy with me playing it onstage either.  People say I have balls to play it.  I say "Yes I do"  :lol:

A point about the hardware.  All hardened steel.  So the nut and saddles and bridge are steel.  I read somewhere the pups where designs of Seymour Duncan.  They were ok actually, but I wanted the raunchy Super D.

I could upgrade to a big brass block (one if which I have lying about spare) but I dunno as I like the axe sounds right now.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on February 14, 2017, 03:30:30 AM
(I could upgrade to a big brass block (one if which I have lying about spare) but I dunno as I like the axe sounds right now.) then probably best just play and enjoy it, although, big brass block mmm LoL
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Harley Hexxe on February 19, 2017, 10:54:36 AM
A very interesting thread here guys,

    As I've just read through this for the first time, I know I can relate with some of what you are saying. But to get back to the very first post here that Dante put up, on the flip side of the coin, aren't most of us brand snobs too?
   I'm referring to guys like me who have a lot of ADA gear, and for us, nothing else will do?

   I'll put any of my ADA rigs up against anything you've got, and I'll either match you tone, or best it!
  As for guitars, sure, I have some American made Fenders that are all considered vintage and collectible, but I'm not a collector, I'm a player, and I play what I like. That's why I also own 3 of the Korean made Fender Showmaster guitars. They have issues, but they also have enormous potential. First of all, these guitar are set-neck and not bolt-on, meaning they are glued in like Gibsons. The wood is African Mahogany, and the fretboard is Brazilian Rosewood. The electronics and hardware it comes with is garbage, especially the locking tuners! Those are the finest examples of over-engineered bullshit that I've seen in all my years of living!
  They come with SD Pearly Gates in the bridge and RWRP JB's in the neck, (HH models). They are 24 fret, 25.5" scale with Dunlop 6105 fretwire, on a 15" radius fretboard. The hardware is cheap pot metal castings of the 2-point Fender style trem, and not even close to stable. Electronics are the cheapest Chinese junk you can find on the internet.
   DiMarzio pots and a Monster switch can fix this up in a hurry, as do the Dimarzio Air Buckers I have in there now. Air Zone, (bridge) Air Norton, (neck). In the other one, I have the same neck pickup, but I have a Steve's Special in the bridge.
   The 3rd one is basically the same guitar but with  a S-S-S pickup configuration. This is my special project that I have planned for the future. That came with SD SSL52 in them but those are the lamest pickups I've ever heard. I've bought a set of Burns Tri-Sonic pickups to put in there, and with a few Push-Push pots and a Mega Switch, and a little creative wiring, it should be quite a different animal! I'm also going to re-do the finish on that guitar since it's the ugliest thing to come along since Pugs were bred.

   I got the 1st one used for $269.00 USD, the 2nd for $300.00 USD and the 3rd, (NOS) $600.00 USD

   The body and neck construction is as solid as it gets, and the tones are pretty warm, so with the mods I'll do to them, these will be my signature axes, but they will work to the end of time if need be. Sometimes you have to crawl through a mountain of mud to find the diamond in the rough.

    Harley 8)
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 20, 2017, 02:23:46 AM
Did I show you my Modern Player Strat yet, guys?
I love its "Adrian Smith" and "Jake E. Lee" look...  :headbanger:


A chinese model with Fender brand on headstock.
A killer (cheap) guitar.
They do not produce it anymore...and I suspect that this is because those guitars could have killed MIM ones...

I've put there some StewMac's pickups...they are excellent!
Golden Age series.
Now I'll change the 6 screws vintage tremolo (same as MIM model) with a better Gotoh one.



Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on February 20, 2017, 03:18:52 AM
Hey Max, very nice  :whoohoo!: .

Hey Harley, any chance of some pics ? Those showmasters sound very interesting.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 20, 2017, 04:52:39 AM
@ Harley I guess to some degree what you say is true.

But I think it was a particular type of snobbery Dante was referring to, which is predominantly focused on those who look down their noses at the cheaper equipment out there.

You could just say chosing to use ADA gear is a preference.  Indeed I use other gear such as my Peavey rockmaster.  I'm not exclusive to ADA equipment.  I just like the ADA MP1's I have.

You'd be a snob if you said "no I only use ADA equipment" and "No I will not use anything else and I am not open to trying or considering other gear even if it sounds as good".

It all depends.

I think there is snobbery with tubes vs anything else for example.  This is another huge topic of debate which I wont get into.  But for me I will not turn my nose up at anything else be it solidstate or digital as I've used both before and I actually moved to tube from digital.  Why?  Not because I thought it was better, but largely an exploration of older equipment in the search for sounds.  I have heard other technologies provide good results so I'll never say never but currently I'm  finding what I want from tube preamps and rack gear and that just happens to be where I am right now.  Can't see me doing a Michael Wagner though hahaha why? Because Profiling gear is so expensive and old rack stuff is a lot cheaper at the moment.


Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 20, 2017, 04:55:29 AM
Hey Max, very nice  :whoohoo!: .

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 20, 2017, 05:03:16 AM

You could just say chosing to use ADA gear is a preference.  Indeed I use other gear such as my Peavey rockmaster.  I'm not exclusive to ADA equipment.  I just like the ADA MP1's I have.

You'd be a snob if you said "no I only use ADA equipment" and "No I will not use anything else and I am not open to trying or considering other gear even if it sounds as good".

It all depends.

I think there is snobbery with tubes vs anything else for example.  This is another huge topic of debate which I wont get into.  But for me I will not turn my nose up at anything else be it solidstate or digital as I've used both before and I actually moved to tube from digital.  Why?  Not because I thought it was better, but largely an exploration of older equipment in the search for sounds.  I have heard other technologies provide good results so I'll never say never but currently I'm  finding what I want from tube preamps and rack gear and that just happens to be where I am right now.  Can't see me doing a Michael Wagner though hahaha why? Because Profiling gear is so expensive and old rack stuff is a lot cheaper at the moment.

+1

I love my Zoom 9150 as my ADA Mp-1!  :thumb-up:
And I'm going to love it more with an incoming Marshall 8008 Valvestate power amp.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 20, 2017, 05:30:34 AM
Not as sexy as my Tokai (already posted this in the axe forum)  It's actually one of my more expensive axes as it has age and collectibility on it's side.

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/WP_20160529_12_19_18_Pro.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/WP_20160529_12_19_18_Pro.jpg.html)

BTW I actually bout the Pink Squier Showmaster, in near mint condition for £90!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  :whoohoo!:

WHAT A STEAL!  That was shipping included.  So actually £70 without the shipping cost.  One of my best guitars.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 20, 2017, 06:11:32 AM
Not as sexy as my Tokai (already posted this in the axe forum)  It's actually one of my more expensive axes as it has age and collectibility on it's side.

(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/WP_20160529_12_19_18_Pro.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/WP_20160529_12_19_18_Pro.jpg.html)


What's that?????  :bow:

I'm currently working on a Fernandes The Function of a friend...restyle, pickup swap and set-up....it's a very nice MIJ guitar.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 20, 2017, 07:21:51 AM
it's a Tokai SD603 Super Strat from 88/89 I believe.  Sounds great!  The trem is only locking at the nut so basically it behaves like a regular strat trem (what do I mean?)  it goes out of tune when you use the floyd rose but when you bend a string it will return to pitch.

You can tune it to stay in tune when you dive b*mb but then when you string bend then you go out of tune and therefore have to dip the trem arm in order to get it return to pitch.

I like some old Fernandes models.  If I had the money I'd buy one of those Brad Gillis Fernandes signature models.  This is pure sexy this guitar!

(http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af347/ConnorF1995/Dad%20Fernandes%20NGD/DSCF1707_zps6e8db41f.jpg) (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/ConnorF1995/media/Dad%20Fernandes%20NGD/DSCF1707_zps6e8db41f.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 20, 2017, 07:30:41 AM
Your Tokai is a lovely, sexy Super Strat!

I will post pictures of that Fernandes once I will finish the job with it!
You will love it...

The FR tremolo is very similar...not a real double-locking (just locking nut).
I removed original crappy pickups and put a DiMarzio SD at bridge and 2 Carvin AP11 single coil pickups.
I'm working on frets, then I'll put it back together and I'll see...
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Dante on February 20, 2017, 07:49:23 PM
Does that Brad Gillis model have the sustainer?
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 21, 2017, 04:32:07 AM
No it doesn't Dante.  I don't think the "Sustainer"  was around back then either.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 22, 2017, 03:01:02 AM
Here we go.
Fernandes The Function, MIJ Super Strat from the '80s.

It was in bad overall conditions (dirt everywhere, dust, rust, bad/no setup, old rusted strings, crappy pickups, FR tremolo issues, very worn frets...) and now it's back to life.

DiMarzio SuperDistortion rules!



Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 22, 2017, 03:02:14 AM
And now, Ladies and Gentlemen...let me introduce you...

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 22, 2017, 07:43:42 AM
And now, Ladies and Gentlemen...let me introduce you...



Holy smokes!  That trem is nearly the same as the one on my Tokia!!  You were right.  However it has different saddles.

Tell me, do you fit the ball end of the string through the  black screws that are used to fit the intonation?  If so then even that is the same as my Tokai.

I like this fernandes!  Those blade pups look great.  How do they sound?

Yes Dimarzio Super D is my fav pickup.  I have about 6-7 of them fitted :)  Not because I am a snob either  :lol:  They just do what I want perfectly.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 22, 2017, 07:51:47 AM
And now, Ladies and Gentlemen...let me introduce you...



Tell me, do you fit the ball end of the string through the  black screws that are used to fit the intonation?  If so then even that is the same as my Tokai.

Exactly the same way!  :thumb-up:
Strings pass through those screws.
Different saddles, same system.
There's Head Crasher engraved there.

I like this fernandes!  Those blade pups look great.  How do they sound?

They sound crappy!
Worst pickups I've ever heard.
Low output, noisy, lack of basses...bad overall tone...
I don't know the models...but it doesn't matter: they're good for garbage.

Original VH-1 pickups I had on a '90s MIJ Burny/Fernandes SuperGrade Les Paul copy were good pickups.
These ones are not at all.

Yes Dimarzio Super D is my fav pickup.  I have about 6-7 of them fitted :)  Not because I am a snob either  :lol:  They just do what I want perfectly.

The Super D is a pickup I'm learning to love a lot...
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 22, 2017, 08:05:19 AM
I like some old Fernandes models.  If I had the money I'd buy one of those Brad Gillis Fernandes signature models.  This is pure sexy this guitar!

(http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af347/ConnorF1995/Dad%20Fernandes%20NGD/DSCF1707_zps6e8db41f.jpg) (http://s1022.photobucket.com/user/ConnorF1995/media/Dad%20Fernandes%20NGD/DSCF1707_zps6e8db41f.jpg.html)

http://alienxnation.com/brad-gillis-fernandes/ (http://alienxnation.com/brad-gillis-fernandes/)

Quote

The non-fine tuner Floyd Roses which we like to call prototypes and the Headbanker on the ST-80BG are awesome and very well made tremolos. These bridges many consider the best Floyds ever produced. We can attest to the fact that these prototypes to the moderdern Floyd Rose tremolos are indeed very tone-full trems which are built much much better than any locking tremolo available today. One secret we can reveal is that the tremolos on these Brad Gillis models despite the fact that they are lacking in fine tuners can manage to stay in tune. While we definitely prefer Floyds that have fine-tuners, when a non-fine tuner floyd is coupled with the same era hump-back Floyd Rose locking nut something magical happens. The guitar stays in tune. Try it, you might just become one of those guys that swears by a Brad Gillis Floyd Rose System. Of course one with the uber-rare hump-back Floyd Rose prototype nut!

100% true: the Head Crasher FR tremolo on that The Function perfectly works...it's smooth and it stays in tune.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on February 22, 2017, 11:39:00 PM
Hey Max, very nice, and I like your trick with the post it notes under the FR  :thumb-up: (I use a folded up guitar cloth to do that bit when I change strings, and I always do the full set...). Nice tidy bench BTW.
But talking about red super strats:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 23, 2017, 02:44:57 AM
Wow...a beautiful Tom Anderson Strat.... :thumb-up:
Epic winner!

The trick with the post-it also makes it easier to tune back the guitar, having the bridge at right level already: you just need to use the right amount of post-it under the bridge to keep it in place as it is with strings.  ^-^
It works fine with 6-screws or standard Strat bridges as well, if you don't use it flat on the top of guitar's body.
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 23, 2017, 07:12:42 AM
That is a nice guitar Richard.  I still like mine better though  :lol:  But I'd gladly play one like yours should I ever come across one at a good price.


@Iperfungus
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190683002440?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&var=490069731866&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190683002440?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&var=490069731866&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)

Check this trem out.  I want to try this out, it actually looks good!  And locks at both ends!  But you can still keep the ball end attached!
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rnolan on February 24, 2017, 02:36:10 AM
Hey RG, they are very nice guitars (I like yours too BTW  :thumb-up: :wave: ), it was one of the first he made (as a Tom Anderson) and the first ProAm in Australia.  I was building guitars back then, when it came into the shop I tried it and was gobsmacked... I thought, try as hard as I can "maybe" I could build something this good (but not better). Took me years to pay it off, it was the first expensive guitar I'd ever bought ($3.5k in 1988ish). It and I are now joined at the hip (as it were). Unfortunately along the way he had to change the peghead design, no doubt fender were at him  :facepalm: , a shame as the newer Anderson pegheads are ugly.

Hey those trems look good  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 24, 2017, 03:00:51 AM


@Iperfungus
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190683002440?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&var=490069731866&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190683002440?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&var=490069731866&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)

Check this trem out.  I want to try this out, it actually looks good!  And locks at both ends!  But you can still keep the ball end attached!

They look hybrid of a FR and an Ibanez Edge!  :lol:
For the price, it worth a try!

Let me know how it works, if you'll try one...
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Kim on February 25, 2017, 08:14:12 AM
I like some old Fernandes models.  If I had the money I'd buy one of those Brad Gillis Fernandes signature models.  This is pure sexy this guitar!

Indeed a sexy guitar!  I was a big fan of Brad Gillis since the Speak of the Devil album he performed on with Ozzy.  That guy had only about one week to rehearse those songs before going on the road, and so his unique improv skills show through very well.  You know...if you can't make it, you fake it.  I spent a lot of time trying to master his particular style of whammy yanking and what I learned about that is to just go your own way.  So while I have that BG whammy in my pocket now, I still whammy my own style......much like learning anything else from your guitar heroes. You do it their way and soon enough your own style takes over.

Quote
....... While we definitely prefer Floyds that have fine-tuners, when a non-fine tuner floyd is coupled with the same era hump-back Floyd Rose locking nut something magical happens. The guitar stays in tune. Try it, you might just become one of those guys that swears by a Brad Gillis Floyd Rose System. Of course one with the uber-rare hump-back Floyd Rose prototype nut!

100% true: the Head Crasher FR tremolo on that The Function perfectly works...it's smooth and it stays in tune.

I have no doubts this particular non-fine tuner system will be "smooth and stay in tune".  However, getting it in tune in the first place could be a problem.  Some serious attention to engineering and detail (that's probably not happening on a mass-production scale) would be needed to prevent the string from going sharp when the locknut is clamped down.  And then there's string stretch to deal with. 
I don't know, I've never tried a guitar with that bridge so maybe it's almost miraculous that it works.  I once actually tried to install a locknut on a strat-trem-bridged guitar and failed miserably for those reasons. Every tremolo bridge I've ever had since then had fine tuners.
I even had a Yamaha guitar (RGX-211) that was single locking, but still had fine tuners.

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 25, 2017, 02:36:14 PM
@Rn and Iperfungus

Yeah those trems look ok.  The guy was selling them a few months back but with no lock at the bottom.  Not the design has been refined.  Now I dunno who the f*ck is making these but I have not saw these for sale any other place.  Which makes me curious.  I think the fit standard FR baseplate guitars so perhaps I will stick on on one of my Squier Stratocasters, just to check it out.  It has hardened steel saddles and plate?  I'll be happy to begin with.  If it performs well, shit................who knows!!  Might buy another!

@Kim  yes BG definitely had to be admired for his contribution to Ozzy osbourne and filling in for Randy Rhodes.  However the first replacement had even less time!!!!!!!!  Three days!!  Know who it was?  This was the guy Ozzy wanted to replace Randy, but he backed out due to the baggage of the whole death and shit.  Pretty sad the whole thing.  I dunno how the f*ck this fellow Irish man handled it (interview with him second link telling about the time)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8bKcZN28SU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8bKcZN28SU)

this interview from the man himself also enlightens us all about the God awful f**king situation it was for him!
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pO8YvXK7Axc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pO8YvXK7Axc)

I think he did a good job

Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 26, 2017, 03:44:14 PM

Quote
....... While we definitely prefer Floyds that have fine-tuners, when a non-fine tuner floyd is coupled with the same era hump-back Floyd Rose locking nut something magical happens. The guitar stays in tune. Try it, you might just become one of those guys that swears by a Brad Gillis Floyd Rose System. Of course one with the uber-rare hump-back Floyd Rose prototype nut!

100% true: the Head Crasher FR tremolo on that The Function perfectly works...it's smooth and it stays in tune.

I have no doubts this particular non-fine tuner system will be "smooth and stay in tune".  However, getting it in tune in the first place could be a problem.  Some serious attention to engineering and detail (that's probably not happening on a mass-production scale) would be needed to prevent the string from going sharp when the locknut is clamped down.  And then there's string stretch to deal with. 
I don't know, I've never tried a guitar with that bridge so maybe it's almost miraculous that it works.  I once actually tried to install a locknut on a strat-trem-bridged guitar and failed miserably for those reasons. Every tremolo bridge I've ever had since then had fine tuners.
I even had a Yamaha guitar (RGX-211) that was single locking, but still had fine tuners.

There are some rules I always follow to have ANY guitar to stay in tune...and it doesn't matter if it's a fixed bridge, a vintage 6-screws or a Floyd Rose...  :thumb-up:

0) HAVE A GOOD NUT!  :lol:
1) mount strings in the right way in tuners: it will be as having locking tuners
2) tune, stretch strings, tune, play, stretch, tune...and go on until they stay in tune with a "4-whole tones bending"
3) now, and only now, close the locking nut if you've a Floyd Rose

That being said, I was talking about non-locking FR saddles, not about the "non fine tuner" FR...  :lol:
I would not use any FR without a fine tuning system...  :facepalm:
Sorry for the little misunderstanding.  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 27, 2017, 01:26:58 AM
So you would not try the fancy trem I posted a link to?

I don't think I will now that there is no fine tuners?
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: Iperfungus on February 27, 2017, 01:33:48 AM
So you would not try the fancy trem I posted a link to?

I don't think I will now that there is no fine tuners?

Those Ebay FR trems are double locking and fine tuners!  :thumb-up:

We were discussing about the non fine tuner trem on Brad Gillis Signature Fernandes...  :lol:
Title: Re: Story time: Brand Name Snobbery
Post by: rabidgerry on February 27, 2017, 03:20:36 AM
Jeeeeeeeez I'm so confused now

I thought Kim had spotted that the trems I put up from ebay were non fine tuner types and I didn’t even check.

So I just took it that they had no fine tuners.  But they do you are right!!!! Worth a shot then I reckon. GAME ON!

The brad gillis guitar looks like it has fine tuners to me, so it doesn’t?  This would be awkward.  If he uses it, it must be ok though otherwise why would be bother.