ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear
Let's Get Technical => Troubleshooting Problems => Topic started by: gg85 on July 08, 2023, 04:45:41 AM
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Hi, I'm new here from Italy, this is my fisrt post here.
I've bought few weeks ago an used ADA mp1 Classic in a local shop. I've tried and worked perfectly.
From yesterday I have an issue:
When I turn on the ADA on the display appears the following message: "Tubes are not ready".
After few seconds it disappears and turn to the last used program.
If I use the voicing on solid state everythings it's ok, but, when I change to "Cln", "brn" or "dist" (or I use a program whit that kind of voicing),I can't ear anything. I tried to turn off and on again but anything has changed. One time only it started to sound again on "dist" but after few second of playing the volume started to decay and I can't ear nothing again. Everyone have any advices?
Thank You in advance
Giulio
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Hey Giulio, welcome to the depot :wave: . Sounds like issues with the tubes ? or tube circuit. MarshallJMP will probably ask you some questions and help sort it out :thumb-up: .
@Dante, did you have similar issues with your classic?
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Hello Giulio, and welcome here :wave:
Definitely, you need fresh tubes in the MP-1 Classic.
Harley 8)
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Tubes would be my first guess too, easy to replace, if it still not works let us know.
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Hi and welcome to the Depot :wave:
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Hi and thank you very much for the feedbacks.
Tomorrow I will try to call the shop to get information about the previous owner and when the tubes were replaced. If the tubes are effectively old I will proceed to replacement.
I'll keep you up-to-date
Giulio
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I don't remember having that problem, but who knows....I've gone through 3 Classics so far
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Atube hasn't to be old to fail, I had new tubes that failed after 2 seconds !!! Doesn't happen much, but just that you know age is not factor.
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Atube hasn't to be old to fail, I had new tubes that failed after 2 seconds !!! Doesn't happen much, but just that you know age is not factor.
Thank You.
Finally I got information about the previous owner. He said the tubes were replaced 5 months ago. In my opinion 5 months is a short life for a tube... but, If MarshallJMP says that could happen, I will proceed to replace them.
I'm not a tube expert. I red in the owner manual that there are 2 12AX7A. I will not replace them by myself, I will ask to a pro. Do you think I should ask for a specific brand? I would try to keep the sound as close to the original as possible.
Thank You
Giulio
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Hi Guilio,
You can probably change the tubes yourself, and what sounds best is entirely up to you. Many of us have gone 'tube rolling' for a day, trying all the 12ax7 tubes we have in our parts bins to see what sounds best. It really is subjective, what sounds best to your ears is all that matters.
If you want to do this yourself, just take your MP-1 out of the rack & remove the top cover. Make sure you have the unit turned off or unplugged before changing the tubes! Carefully insert your new tube being sure to note where the 'space' in the pins is - line that up and push the tube into the socket. They can be stiff at times and require a little gentle nudging back & forth to get them in. Make sure they're seated all the way down and turn the power on. Give them a minute or two to warm up.
Try solid state and distortion, see how they perform in each one. I'd try one tube at a time. Some will be crystal clean on SS and then sound underwhelming on distortion patches, some will be distorted in the cleans but sound amazing in the distortions, find the one(s) that suit your taste.
NOTE: If you feel uneasy at all about this, just bring it to a pro and hopefully they won't charge you too much to do it, but you'll be relying on their ears instead of your own.
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Thank you Dante for your advices.
Do the tubes affect the solid state section?
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I'm not a technical guy, but I can change the tubes.
If I remember correctly, both tubes will affect the SS Section, I believe they act differently in SS mode....I haven't had an MP-1 in a long time, but I think V1 tube handles compression on SS?
Somebody correct me here, I don't know what I'm talking about
My advice; search around the Tube section, there are TONS of posts about that. Somebody must have mentioned what V1 and V2 do, respective to voicings. I would try anything and everything that has "12ax7" on it (or 12ax7a, or 12ax7b, or whatever).
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Dante,
This is a MP-1 Classic, in which case, the tube and solid state sections are separated from each other. It's only in the original MP-1 that the solid state is mixed with the tube section.
Guilio: You can change the tubes yourself and it's much easier than you think. As Dante said remove the top cover and remove the old tubes. Many people here like the JJ tubes, but I'm not a big fan of them, as I believe the quality of them has dropped quite a bit in the last several years. There are Mullard reissue tubes that sound pretty decent, and many users prefer those In the ADA preamps. As Dante also mentioned, it's really what your ears want to hear that matters. I've recently been looking at Tube Amp Doctor for tubes as they seem to be a bit better quality than what is readily available. Tubes should last a couple of years at least. 5 months is nothing. They must have been really cheap tubes. I have a few choices myself. If I can find a good pair of Mullards, I'll use those because the Classic doesn't have as much low end as the original, so long plate 12AX7 tubes will help that a little. Also, I've tried some Gold Lion, and they are alright if I use one in V1 and a Mullard in V2.
Experiment with different tubes yourself and see what you like.
Harley 8)
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Dante,
This is a MP-1 Classic, in which case, the tube and solid state sections are separated from each other. It's only in the original MP-1 that the solid state is mixed with the tube section.
Sorry! I missed that I guess. My bad
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Hey Guilio, just to backtrack a little, we are guessing that the tubes (one or other) is the problem and why you don't have distortion patches working. Swapping out the tubes for known good ones is easy and won't hurt anything and may fix the issue. If it doesn't fix it then something else is wrong (possibly with the tube circuit board). Another approach is find a tech with a tube tester and test the 2 tubes. So take off the top of the unit, remove the tubes from their sockets, they may be a little tight but gently pull them out. Then you can take them to be tested. The tubes will have writing on them saying what they are, so scribble that down and tell us. Either way, swapping in new known good tubes or testing the current tubes rules them in or out of your current problem and is the easiest place to start trying to work out what's wrong, and would probably be the first thing a tech would do trying to fix it. Now again 5 months is nothing for a tube, even with constant use they should last a couple of years but they can and do fail. It may be just one tube is dead (so if you can, get them tested).
That said, at some point you will need to replace them so buying a new pair want go to waste. Selecting new tubes is a rabbit hole. They are only made in 3 countries (Slovakia (JJs), China (TAD and other brands), and Russia (lots of good brands but harder to source since the war and Vlad decided to block tube exports to the west which has also pushed up the price :facepalm: ).
All 12AX7 tubes brands are electrically equivalent, i.e. they will all work in your MP-1 Classic. However, they all sound a little (sometimes allot) different. Also some seem to suit the ADA circuit better than others (tone/sound wise). ADA had tubes made for them in China. The closest to the original ADA tubes are probably TADs. Have a good read through the tube posts http://adadepot.com/index.php?board=38.0 (http://adadepot.com/index.php?board=38.0)
So our advice so far is to 1. rule tubes in/out as the issue (easy to do and is the most likely cause of your problem (but it may no be :dunno: ) 2. what you can easily do yourself and not have to pay a tech to do it. I buy my tubes from Tube Audio in Melbourne (Australia) https://tubeaudio.com.au/mullard-12ax7-ecc83/ (https://tubeaudio.com.au/mullard-12ax7-ecc83/). I use Mullard Long plates in all my MP-2s. They have gone from $25 AUD each to $40 AUD (because of the war). These are the Mullards Harley referred to and they will work quite well in your Classic. Wherever you buy tubes from, make sure they are a reputable site that test the tubes before they sell them and have a good returns policy in case they are duds (they shouldn't be duds but it can happen).
Now I'm hoping that your issue is just a bad tube (unlikely it's both of them). Swapping in some known good tubes will answer that question, but as I said, you can get them tested, you need to find someone with a tube tester, a device that most tube amp techs will have and only takes a few minutes.
EDIT: Check if both tubes a glowing, so take off the lid, power the unit up (careful not to touch anything while the power is on) and check that both tubes are glowing and look them same. If one tube is glowing and the other isn't, then you've located the bad tube (if this is the problem).
The next step below is still worth trying even if one tube isn't glowing as it "may" fix it and it's free and easy to do.
The very first thing you could try (make sure the power is OFF!) is just pulling out the current tubes and putting them back in a couple of times. It is possible that the connection in the tube socket has a little bit of dust or whatever. If the guy you bought it from replaced the tubes, he may have sprayed some contact cleaner into the tube sockets to clean them. While this seems a good idea it's NOT. There's a post MJMP did ages ago which explains why you shouldn't do that (basically makes any dust in the socket worse). So pulling them in and out a few times may just fix it? And doing that will give you a little confidence changing tubes, it is very easy, take your time, be gentle(ish), don't force anything, line up the pins, there's a gap you need to line up and it takes a little pressure to push them all the way in.
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Hi,
I'm very grateful for your help!
Something strange happened this morning: turned on my ADA, switched to a program with voicing set to "dist" and it started playing at a low volume, but gradually the volume started to increase and the distortion became more and more high until it reached a good level.
Now I'm very confused..
I don't know if the next time I will use the ADA it will works. Are you still convinced the problem could be caused by the tubes or could it be something else?
Thank you
Giulio
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Could be something else but again my first impression is the tubes or one of them.
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MJMP,
Doesn't this symptom sound like a restriction in the voltage supply to the tube(s)?
Giulio,
What happens if you switch to another distortion program when it comes up to volume? Does it go to that program and play at full volume or does that gradually swell up to volume too?
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It could be as simple as some dust in the socket causing some resistance that comes and goes. Hence my suggestion to pull the tubes out and back in a couple of times, may just fix it? and is free and easy to try.
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MJMP,
Doesn't this symptom sound like a restriction in the voltage supply to the tube(s)?
That's my second guess.
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Hi everybody,
I'm very sorry for no response from last times.
I'm very gratefull for helping me.
MJMP,
Doesn't this symptom sound like a restriction in the voltage supply to the tube(s)?
Giulio,
What happens if you switch to another distortion program when it comes up to volume? Does it go to that program and play at full volume or does that gradually swell up to volume too?
If the volume goes down and I switch to another program the volume still go down.
Finally, good news. I changed the tubes, not by myself but with the help of an expert. He said me that the tubes were gone. It was strange because were good quality tubes. After the replacement the problems disappeared. Now it's almost a month from the replacement and works perfectly.
Thanky you very much guys!
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Could be something else but again my first impression is the tubes or one of them.
Listen to that intuition, it serves you (and us) well :thumb-up:
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Giulio,
It's possible to buy new tubes these days and still get bad ones right out of the box. I never buy them from music shops for that reason, and this is also the reason many of them have a "no return" policy for tubes.
I'm glad your issues have been solved
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I strongly agree with Harley.
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+1
got a brand new set of bad power tubes online
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Let me guess, Musician's Friend?
I got a bad pair of Mullards from them several years ago.
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Nope, Amazon....stay away
Two leaky tubes, one bad, one good. A matched quad of TADs
My tech told me what was happening & put Svetlanas in - all good now
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Thanks for the heads up!
But then again, Amazon and ebay, are really about the same in the sense that you could be getting them from anywhere or anyone, unless it's specified from a dealer. Even then, you'd have to know the dealer's reputation.
Musician's Friend, (until it comes to tubes), definitely not a good place to buy.
Sweetwater, I got good Gold Lion tubes from them, but the Mullards I got were borderline.
I'm going to give TAD a try direct, and I'll give Antique Electronic Supply a try at them, although they are more transparent about their tube sales. They admit they don't test or sort them out to make matched sets. So I guess that's to be expected online?
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Well I used to buy all my tubes from doug's tubes, both new and NOS and never had any problems. Now with all the EU import s**t it became too expensive which is a shame.
https://dougstubes.com/
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Yeah, he's been kind of pricey for the last several years
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Yes but on the other hand you get tested tubes and warranty on them.
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I've been buying mine from https://tubeaudio.com.au/mullard-12ax7-ecc83/ (https://tubeaudio.com.au/mullard-12ax7-ecc83/) They test them all, and I've not had any duds. Price jumped from around AUD$22 to now AUD $42 (USD $26.70) since the Russian invasion. Given the AUD is really low right now (0.64 USD), and they are small and light it may work out not too expensive? But as MJMP says, import s**t/cost may make it cost prohibitive :facepalm: :dunno: .