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ADA Preamps => Original MP-1 => Topic started by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 29, 2014, 05:39:28 AM

Title: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 29, 2014, 05:39:28 AM
Good day my friends.

So here's my rig:

Guitar --> ADA MP1 --> TC Electronic G Force --> Mesa Boogie 20/20 --> Palmer PGA04 --> Lexicon Omega soundcard --> KRK Rokit 5 active studio monitors

Following the above:

1) How do I know if I have an "original" or a "classic"?
2) How should I go connection wise?
    a) ADA's Output A & Output B to G Force's inputs and from G Force's outputs to Boogie's inputs, or
    b) ADA's FX Loop send to G Force's left input and out of G Force's left output to ADA's return input and from ADA's Output A & Output B to Boogie's inputs?

What do you think is the "best"?

Also can you advise any online stores with ADA parts just in case?

Thank you!!!
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: RandallRG on January 29, 2014, 05:53:46 AM
Hey Dude as far as what unit you have it will say "Classic" on the front if it only says MP-1 well then you know what you have! As far as a "Online" store for parts etc Marshall is about the ONLY one that has any parts for the MP-1 (He is the MP-1 "Guru" around here)  :thumb-up: & as far as hooking it all up the correct & BEST way....I am sure Marshall or Rich will be on & help you out. Take it easy & Best of luck Dude! \m/  :metal:
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 29, 2014, 06:46:46 AM
Thank you my friend.

Seems I have the original one.

I also saw Marshall's website and I am sure I will need to consume a bit of his time concerning what I'm thinking of doing and it what I'm thinking is possible, but will do so when I figure out the "right" way of hooking this up.

To tell you the truth I tried both ways I wrote above... with b) it seemed strange to me how the front output level and the back loop level interacted with G Force; resulting in me constuntly tweeking to find a sweet spot that would allow the units not to clip. Besides that, there was some noise overall and sounded that something was not quite right...

With a) things were quite noise wise and better overall, but I am still asking in case I'm missing something and should review things in a different way.

More questions will follow :-)

Thanks again!!!
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 29, 2014, 02:15:35 PM
I would go the "A" route,else you will loose the stereo effect of the G force.My setup is the same (mp-1,G-force).And like you say the mp-1 effectloop is a tricky thing,i never use it.It seems some like it,some don't.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on January 29, 2014, 06:09:04 PM
I agree  with MJMP, given the MP1 loop is serial it makes no sense to use it as the signal will be A/D converted regardless so go with the stereo approach and get the full potential of the G Force.  There's a slightly better way but it involves using a small stereo mixer that has at least 4 line inputs and 2 effect (Aux) sends.  This way you can preserve the analogue signal from the MP1 and mix in the G Force signal which has been A/D and then D/A converted.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 29, 2014, 11:41:22 PM
Seems I'll keep the a) scenario.

Concerning stereo effects, I wouldn't be able to use them either way since the Palmer unit is mono :-( (Palmer does offer stereo solutions but would exceed my budget...)

I'll come back with a few more questions within day.

Thanks!
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 30, 2014, 04:20:18 AM
Well you could place the G force after the palmer to use it as a stereo effect.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 30, 2014, 04:36:28 AM
Well, I placed the Palmer last in line, since it simulates speakers and mic.
Placing the G Force after it, will the G Force send a "proper" signal to my sound card or will it sound "bad"?
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 30, 2014, 04:38:53 AM
Normally you should have the same sound IMHO.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on January 30, 2014, 05:43:10 AM
I'll give it a try and see how it works out.

Thanks!
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 30, 2014, 01:07:09 PM
Ok keep us updated.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 01, 2014, 08:11:51 PM
When I want to record or just play at home through the studio monitors I swap my MP2 outs (which feed 2 channels in my small mixer) to the cab emulated outs, my Quadverb then gets the cab emulated signal (from Aux 1 and Aux 2 of the mixer) and back into 2 mixer channels (and careful not to send these 2 to Aux 1 or 2 (feedback loop)).  The mixer then feeds 2 channels of my studio setup to record/monitor.  Sounds great so (as MJMP suggests) Palmer before G Force should be fine. You could also try the Palmer in the MP1 loop as long as you can get the levels right (ie it shouldn't be adding or taking away gain), this way you get the MP1 stereo chorus etc.
The cab/mic simulation is basically an EQ curve (no doubt with some other tweaks) to emulate the sound of guitar speakers (less tops as no tweeter).  Effect units will process (effect) the modified sound and will send a "proper" signal to your sound card.  Without the Palmer, the sound to the sound card will still work fine but will be very toppy through your monitors (as they have a tweeter).
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 04, 2014, 12:52:48 AM
So...ADA is the winner!
ENGL E570 is now on sale.
Once it goes I will further experiment with ADA and see how I finalize the set up.
I see that some of you like and some don't the BBE maximizers.
I am thinking of adding one to my rig...
I am also thinking of replacing the Palmer PGA04 with the Torpedo Live but the above is just me thinking loud, not sure what will I do.
Feel free to elaborate of course.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: kawai2g4b on February 04, 2014, 01:47:01 AM
For me, the BBE Maximizer and the like stay with my bass rigs and not my MP-1.  It's all to taste really.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: brianiac5150 on February 04, 2014, 06:56:19 AM
I am also thinking of replacing the Palmer PGA04 with the Torpedo Live...

Unless you want the TNTL for the loadbox capability with other amplifiers, the Torpedo CAB will be perfect and save you some cash - unless you do like I'm really wanting to do and get two CAB's for running stereo (AWESOME).  Of course, the MIDI CAB changing of two units I've not yet worked through, but it works great with one.

Trust me: adding a Two Notes product to your setup is one of the best things you can do.

BTW...I'm running a BBE 482i with mine and really like it.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 04, 2014, 07:27:57 AM
I lost you with the TNTL (what does it mean?).
Since I do not use cab/s at all and run directly to the soundcard right out of the Palmer, I do not think I can use the Torpedo Cab for this purpose right?
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 04, 2014, 10:11:03 PM
After checking this link Micky sent me (http://artproaudio.com/artcessories/mini_mixers/product/splitmix4/) I have a new patching option you could try.  The SplitMix4 is a very versatile little number and perfect for this patching scheme (cost here is $99 AUD), it's passive, no power supply requirement. This patch need 3 or 4 insert leads (Stereo Jack to 2 mono jacks (tip ring sleve (TRS) <> tip sleve (TS))).  The last lead needs to be Stereo jack (TRS) to whatever your sound card input needs (eg stereo mini jack, RCA ??)
So another (probably (definitely IMHO) the best) alternative: MP1 outs A/B to Art splitter in (2 x TS <> TRS) Art 1 vol is then MP1 dry signal, Art 2 out to G Force ins (TRS <> 2 x TS), G Force outs to Art 2 mixer in (2 x TS <> TRS), and Art mixer out to power amp or in your case sound card ins (TRS <> 2 x TS (or stereo mini jack)). So Art 1 vol is MP1 dry, Art 2 vol is G Force,  G Force can (should) be set to full wet and Art vol 3 and 4 turned off (as they will also be MP1 dry if I'm right about the internal patching).  Put the Palmer in the MP1 loop so the cab emulation is done but you get full stereo into your sound card.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 05, 2014, 12:08:34 AM
That seems like a nice approach, thanks.
For the time being unfortunately, I keep the ENGL hooked up in order for any potential buyer to be able to check it asap...so ADA is on stand by waiting patiently the ENGL to be sold and it to take its place and start rocking out while trying different approaches as per your suggestions guys here!

Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 05, 2014, 10:53:32 PM
No worries (endaxi), good luck with the sale, cheers Richard
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 06, 2014, 12:59:43 AM
Ευχαριστώ!!!

I am bored to death to switch cables, therefore play with ENGL until it's gone... :(
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 06, 2014, 08:23:50 PM
I'll have to get my ex wife to translate, I learnt to speak a tiny bit of Greek over the years but not read and write
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 07, 2014, 12:30:25 AM
Ευχαριστώ --> Thanks ;-) - Efharisto
Σε ευχαριστώ --> Thank you (singular) - Se efharisto
Σας ευχαριστώ --> Thank you (plural) - Sas efharisto
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 07, 2014, 07:08:00 AM
OOpps, that's a very basic one - and one I'm quite particular about, as Greeks seem to loose please and thank you in their conversations .....peracilo...effcharisisto... ;)
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: brianiac5150 on February 07, 2014, 10:03:06 AM
I lost you with the TNTL (what does it mean?).
Since I do not use cab/s at all and run directly to the soundcard right out of the Palmer, I do not think I can use the Torpedo Cab for this purpose right?

TNTL = Two Notes Torpedo Live

You certainly use the CAB or Live to do everything - and a whole lot more than - the Palmer does.  I've heard the Palmer products are excellent, as well,though.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 18, 2014, 02:15:46 AM
Even though the ENGL remains unsold, I hooked up the ADA again and constantly play with it.
The sound I am getting is really good for my taste.
I feel though that there's more potential.

In order to further explore that, what would your suggestions be?
I am thinking of a BBE maximizer or an equalizer.
What do you think?

If we go the equalizer way, should that be a graphic one or a parametric one?

Thanks
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 18, 2014, 07:41:14 PM
Personally, I wouldn't use either but there seems many here who like the BBE, I've never tried one nor feel the need, my MP1 was fantastic and did all I needed and more, my MP2 is even better and while it has a graphic eg built in I don't use it much at all.  If you went for an eq, I'd use a graphic (7 band is heaps although 15 band are more common).  Parametric eqs provide more control (boost/cut, centre frequency, width (notch/shelf)) where the graphic is set except for boost/cut and parametric generally give you less bands eg 4 band (high, high mid, low mid, low) to cover the frequency range.  The other thing with eq is they all sound different (some great, some ok, some terrible).
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on February 19, 2014, 01:24:35 PM
I would go for an eq,never really liked a BBE.A parametric eq isually a bit better to get the right sound,but a graphic is also nice.I use a ADA MQ-1 in my rig and these are also very good but a bit hard to find.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 20, 2014, 02:18:47 AM
Any eq suggestions (parametric and/or graphic) at a reasonable price?
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 20, 2014, 07:04:21 AM
The ADA MQ1 would be a perfect choice, the eq centre frequencies are designed for guitar, I've not used one but all reports here are they are very good (if you can find one). There are many eqs around, I seem to remember one of the guys posted he had a Behringer eq he liked although Behringer gear has lost it's lustre a bit lately IMHO.  DBX (eg DBX 215) make some good graphics at a reasonable price, I paid ~$180 AUD for a dual 15 band not the best I've heard but good for the price but the centre frequencies are ISO standard which suits PAs etc ie not tailored for guitar (and are line level devices). Steve (RandallRG) likes his 6 band MXR, I've always liked MXR pedals, I had a MXR phase 45 as my first ever pedal. Another option is use the eq in your G Force ??  My mates got a G Major and he says its got parametric eq built in.  Maybe post the question in the effects area and see what the other guys have played with.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 20, 2014, 01:03:52 PM
G Force indeed has some EQ filters, but i wasn't really digging their impact.
Will surely tweek them more to see if i can avoid getting another unit.
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 20, 2014, 09:40:58 PM
If they are parametric like the G Major (so probably are) you get 3 variable parameters per eq band being boost/cut, centre frequency and width/shape of the eq curve.  So I'd guess there will be at least 4 bands (to cover from 20hz to 20khz) each completely adjustable within the eq bands frequency range.  The width/shape variable adjusts from notch (affects centre frequency and not much either side (good for surgically removing a problem frequency)) to wide (affects more frequencies either side of the centre freq depending on the width).
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 21, 2014, 03:26:23 AM
Truth is I was fooling around for quite a while yesterday with the G-Force filters after your post, but didn't get any good results.
I ended up having a better sound with the eq off.

I do not have past experience with eqing in order to know where to put my hands on and know what to expect.
I aim at smoothing out the "hiss" of high frequencies and tightening the bass a bit.

Is the above sth an eq can do for me?
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 21, 2014, 08:19:45 AM
Eq settings can be a bit of an art form, also my approach to eqs is very much influenced by being an audio engineer (studio & live).  I've always found the eq in the MP1 and MP2 quite fine for the job but if you want to use additional eq:
Hiss tends to be around 8khz to 10khz ish (but I've never had a hiss problem with either MP1 or MP2), remember presence boost is ~6khz so will add to the "hiss" area but also make the sound prominent (stand out/cut through) as between 1khz to 5 or 6 khz is the most sensitive part of our hearing.  If you are getting hiss, my guess is the gain structure isn't optimal as noise is getting boosted (hiss) and not enough signal. To tighten the bass I'd recommend lowering the low mids a bit ~160hz, 320hz but this can be done on the MP1/2 by lowering the mids a bit (-4ish), add a bit of bass  2 to  4 ish, Tad of treb ( 4 ish) bit of pres ( 6 ish), OD1 higher or the same as OD2...

Another thing you might consider is where in the TCs routing chain you place its eq, to use the eq as I think you are trying for you'd route it so the eq is first and in serial so the guitar signal feeds the eq and then the eq output feeds the rest of the (time based) effects (delay, reverb etc) in the TC.

A way to play with parametric eqs is set the band (eg HIs) to either full cut or full boost (while listening), sweep the centre frequency up/down (and hear what it's affecting), get that selected centre freq boosting/cutting so it  sounds goodish, change the band width/slope to widen/narrow the affected area.

On a guitar tuned to A = 440 hz, bottom E is 82hz, A 440hz is the A on the 5th fret of the top (high) E, so understanding the frequency range can help with eq decisions.  Hope this helps Cheers Richard
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Panagiotisrx7 on February 21, 2014, 10:56:34 AM
Thank you very much Richard!
Will definitely give it another try following all below!
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: RandallRG on February 24, 2014, 06:47:35 PM
Very good "E.Q." post/info there Rich. Hope all is well Mate!  :metal:
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: rnolan on February 24, 2014, 09:49:23 PM
Thanks Steve, hope it helps. Been learning (remembering  ;) ) Monkey Wrench and Teenage Dirt bag with the new band I've started with a couple of good mates, Bass player has only been playing for 6 months so he's struggling with Monkey Wrench, wait till I get him playing Highway Star and Burn...or maybe even resurrect You Fool No one (9th vox harmonies)  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: Zsoli on February 27, 2014, 06:41:17 AM
My rig:

Gibson SG Standard -> ADA MP1 -> H&K RedBox MKIII speaker simulator -> BOSS SE50 stereo effects processor -> PC

http://youtu.be/tHaNsN_GcFQ
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: MarshallJMP on February 27, 2014, 12:07:57 PM
My rig:

Gibson SG Standard -> ADA MP1 -> H&K RedBox MKIII speaker simulator -> BOSS SE50 stereo effects processor -> PC

http://youtu.be/tHaNsN_GcFQ

WAUW that was good,nice playing really nice sound,me like  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: My new rig includes an ADA MP1 and I need your help
Post by: RandallRG on February 27, 2014, 12:21:19 PM
My rig:

Gibson SG Standard -> ADA MP1 -> H&K RedBox MKIII speaker simulator -> BOSS SE50 stereo effects processor -> PC

http://youtu.be/tHaNsN_GcFQ

WAUW that was good,nice playing really nice sound,me like  :thumb-up:
X2! Very cool & the Fire Effect was Awesome!! Hey Marshall....Hope all is well Buddy! :metal: