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[El Chiguete]

I'm planing a little complicated setup that would maybe need to place long cable to the input of the MP-1 so I'm thinking of puting in a buffer to better drive the signal thru a long cable, so my question is does the MP-1 take well a buffer signal to drive a long cable? It can be a buffer signal from maybe the output a tuner pedal.

[rnolan]

He El, the problem (and it's mostly about impedance I think): guitar PU/output impedance approx 7kohms (single coil) - approx 16kohms (humbucker) > lead (length/wire/thickness variables) > MP1 input.  Rule of thumb (someone else can tell us the math) after 20 to 25 feet of guitar cable at instrument level you'll start to loose significant top end hence most guitar cables are shorter than that. Low impedance (e.g. 600ohm mics) can go much further with out signal degradation (particularly tops) (i.e. mic > stage box > (multicore) desk).  Can you buffer in between, yes, will the MP1 care, not if you do it right, can you use a tuner to do it, depends, mostly not as the tuner generally provides a direct pass through (so just makes a longer cable).  What you need is a unit that (kind of) terminates the guitar lead, processes the signal and sends it on e.g. a powered pedal (chorus, delay whatever).  The pedals have active (powered) circuits, opp amps etc all the stuff so it's like starting again (lead end to end) but they screw with the sound (don't do it if you don't have to but it will work) again however, some will have direct analogue pass through and will be just like making a longer lead (bad again). You can use DI devices to turn the signal into low impedance (DI Box) and turn it back at the other end, not sure how the MP1 will react to a low impedance signal ? may be fine ?? MJMP/Sparker ??
Or you could go wireless, while I'm not a huge fan (they tend to "gate" off when you let chords ring), easy way to solve a distance problem.

[El Chiguete]

Actually my idea is to use the Relay switches of my foot controller (Lexicon MPX R1) and build an a/b switch so I can switch from connecting straight to the input of the MP-1 or connect to the front of my multieffects processor (Lexicon MPX-G2).

Why I want to do this? Because with the MPX-G2 I can place the MP-1 thru 4-cable method anywhere in the loop and get effects before and after it BUT you can notice that the tone gets changed a little after the AD/DA converters... so the idea is that I would go first to the MPX-G2 just when I need it but the rest of the time I would connect straight to the MP-1.

[rnolan]

Hey El, interesting patch concept  and I suspect will work fine, my personal goal however, is to ensure the main signal (guit > preamp > amp) is unadulterated and analogue all the way (BTW this is the BEST way to go for live not in the bedroom). But some FX would be nice, got stereo chorus already in the ADA MP1/2 so I need to blend in some time based FX (delay/flange?/reverb). So I strive to ensure the digital part of the chain (i.e. anywhere there's a/d d/a conversion) is mixed/blended into the analogue signal.
A better patch IMHO would be to use a small stereo mixer with 2 effects sends, MP1 ch 1/2, aux/FX sends 1/2 to MPX-G2, MPX-G2 > ch 3/4 (don't turn up aux/FX sends on 3/4) > poweramp/cabs, and mix it together...
If there are sounds you want apart from FX in the MPX-G2 will change things, above is simple way using MP1 sounds...

[El Chiguete]

I will do that small stereo mixer in the future (still waiting for your video review and tutorial of how to do this and the comparison of the tone before and after jeje) but this will be only for the post MP-1 effects, what I'm talking here is just to be able to use specific effects before the MP-1 from time to time when I need to (vol, wah, pitch shift, etc) but then for the rest of the time just have the guitar go straigh to the MP-1 BTW I'm only thinking of this because my Lexicon unit allows me to place the MP-1 anywhere in the chain and have any effect before or after it!

Yesterday I gave more though on this and what I need to do is a switcher that allows me to either go true bypass to the output or place a loop in or out the signal in front of the MP-1 that way I can plug the guitar to that switcher and when I want to (controled by the foot controller) I can insert the effects that would be infront of the preamp in the chain. This would be the connections:

1) input of the guitar to the switcher
2) output of the switcher
3) loop send (to the front of the Lexicon, other effect unit or pedal)
4) loop return (from loop send of the Lexicon, other effect unit or pedal)

[rnolan]

Hey El, personally I'm not a fan for "anything" before the MP1/2, I hear where you're coming from but of all the things you want to add pre MP1, volume pedal is the only one I'd do there (but if you have lots of pedals, go for it, but this is why GOD invented line level FX processors, so we could get away from all that stuff in front of us, (that all need power supplies and stuff up you gain settings, and crap the guit signal by A/D, D/A ing it)).  IMHO you do not want to pollute your sound from the guit before it gets to the MP1, you can, but I wouldn't!  Mix it in after is the best way to go.
I'll try to make you a video thing, not my forte, if you try what I've talked/ranted about, you'll hear the difference for yourself in much better resolution (coz you are there hearing it, not some crappy youtube shit resolution) 
Not to cast nastertioms on you patch idea, it's quite valid but possibly not good gain structure (depending on gadgets), you want that stuff (FX) to be happening at line level and the MP1 getting  good clean/not polluted guitar feed.  Quite frankly, the only thing I'd recommend for MP1 is maybe "analogue" vol pedal before MP1, and cab sim (e.g. ADA GCS-3) in MP1 loop for recording etc.

[El Chiguete]

I also understand why you want to keep the signal ¨pure¨ from the guitar to the amp but my question to you is: if you have to use one a wah pedal (and you dont need any other efect) would you run a wah after the MP-1? I believe that the order of effects in the chain have different results on the final sound, for example:

1) a wah after the guitar affects only the tone of the guitar and then that modulation gets amplified by the amp but a wah after the amp affects/modulates the tone of the amp...

2) a chorus after the guitar make you have a ¨chorus of guitars¨ that meens that it simulates you have more guitars playing at the same time (BTW thats the idea behind a 12 string guitar and that IS the original reason why they invented the chorus effect) but a chorus after the amp will actually make a ¨chorus of amps¨ in essence like if your sound came from many amps/speakers at the same time.

3) a vol pedal after the guitar you are lowering and rasing the signal that goes in to the amp but a vol pedal after that amp you will only be lowering and rasing the volume of a finish signal (just like if you lower and raise a master volume knob on the amp)... and this is something that if you do volume swells have two very different results specially if you are doing it to a distortion tone.

The truth is that there is no correct way to do things but depending on what you actually want to do changin the order of things does make a difference.

Finally I just want to remember that the idea of what I want to do is just for special moments of a song and not to have it on for the hole song just for the same reason that you said of preserving the pure signal of the guitar.

[rnolan]

Hey El, Wah I'd put before MP1, or in the MP1 loop but not after.  I'm all for keeping the MP1 outs direct to power amp, not chained through anything, I go via a mixer (as you know) so I can "mix" in line level effects but maintain the analogue signal to the power amp (moreover I'm applying those FX to the line level distorted MP1/2 tones, like a PA mix).
With instrument level effects (wah, delay, chorus pedals etc) obviously they go better (in the gain structure) before the MP1.  You can rune them in the MP1 loop (so the signal is preamped and tubed/distorted already) and as you say that will sound different as they are applying them selves to a pre amped signal rather than a straight guitar signal.  But the MP1 loop will "buffer" them as is an active circuit and you can adjust the gain.
Each device you are thinking of probably needs it's own consideration as to where you put it.  You could run a wah in the loop, but just as easily before MP1.  The only real difference running things in the MP1 loop or in front of MP1 is the input to the MP1 (how it's affected, e.g. to much gain hits it) and the signal the devices are effecting (as you can run the loop at inst level).  The loop is serial so apart from the level buffereing, the signal is routed through the device/devices and back (you now have no direct unpolluted MP1 signal), however, you can use the Art splitter mixer (or similar) to make the loop parallel (i.e. mix them into the signal).

To make a switchable effects loop before the MP1, you could make/adapt a foot switch thingy that has: guit input jack > output select switch (which is wired to out jack socket), loop out jack (parallel off input jack) - loop rtrn jack > output select switch (which is wired to output jack...) so output switch switches between the 2 signal paths.  This is passive though, not buffered and you'd have to get all you gains worked out with what goes through the loop.
You could complicate it further by having A/B or A + B switching. i.e. MP1 direct only (A), MP1 through loop only(B) or MP1 direct and loop to output jack (A+B).
If you want it buffered and tidy, you could use the new ADA APP1 before the MP1 and use it's loop, careful with the gain however.....

[RobbHell]

Im not a fan of anything into the front of the MP1 but my guitar lol but I love delays,flanges and wah to be ran before my Distortion. Its a give and take lol.