ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear
ADA Preamps => Original MP-1 => Topic started by: StillClimbing on December 08, 2019, 06:47:48 PM
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Hey there fellow cult members! I am the new owner the Mk 2 Mod 4 variety and I am trying to get my first rack rig all together. Right now for volume I am running it into the loop of my Crate Blue Voo Doo (I was actually using it before Mart Friedman). Most of my gear I have had from my guitar-into-100 w head days. Here is the gear I have so far:
-DMC ground control midi floor unit
-4X12 custom cab with real British vintage 30s
-Ibanez 1991 7 band EQ pedal (apparently this is well regarded)
-MXR Micro amp (used this for a lead boost in front of my head)
-Morely Wah 1993 vintage
-some Japanese boutique-ish chorus pedal (apparently a fairly well-respected chip set, the place burned down in the 80s... I got it somewhere along the line for $25 and apparently its something good)
-DOD FX 96 (made in USA) analog delay in near mint condition (this is a new purchase)
-Dan Electro BLT slap back echo (this has recently disappeared so I don't know its location currently)
- BBE sonic stomp & Aphex guitar Exciter with big bottom (thought I'd try both out)
-Gear I am looking to get: a reverb pedal/source (used to having reverb on my amp head) & a rack effects unit
I don't anticipate me needing the chorus pedal as I have the best chorus I have heard on-board the MP 1. I don't necessarily have to use any/all of these. My thought is to get a rack effects unit such as an Intellifex (or intelliverb but they are rare) because they keep your signal intact and mix in the effects. Then A/B that against how it sounds with my DOD delay in the loop & reverb pedal after. So I am wanting to know people's experience with...…
1) rack effects units: I know Intellifex/intelliverb is a good choice but what else might be good?
2) how this thing take pedals in front/in the loop/after?
3) I know most people probably don't use the loop, but Nuno did, so who else does?
4) BBE VS Aphex: what is people's experience with these? I have the pedal versions but I would consider rack units if they are better. I haven't had an opportunity to mess with the Aphex much because it just got here, but the BBE pedal really does something (at least at low volume... haven't had an opportunity to try things out at "gig" volume)
5) Power amp selection? I can get a Microtube 100 fairly reasonably but a different one ( say a Mesa or Marshal or even the G&K 250VK) is more $$$. Im sure they sound better but any place I will eventually play out I will have to run low stage volume & DI to FOH
Thanks for your input.... I look forward to hear from everyone's experience.
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Welcome!
first thing you should do is get a mixer. this will allow you to run multiple rack effects in parallel instead of daisy chaining effects together. think of how effects such as reverb and delay is added afterwards when you are in a recording studio. This will keep your analog signal pure without going through digital effects units and converting digital back to analog.
i use a Custom audio line mixer running 3 different effect units in parallel.
as for power amp, it is all personal preference. i recommend tube power amps. mesa/marshall/ VHT and ADA are all good choices. These may not be easy to find.
it really depends on your budget when choosing fx units and personal preference.
please run your ADA mp1 in stereo to get the full effect of the chorus.
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There's a bunch of ways you can patch it all. The main consideration is to ensure you keep your gain structure as best it can be. Like Chamai, I've always used a mixer and run the rig a bit like a PA set up. I use an old Yamaha AM802, 8 ch with 3 FX sends, I have it velcroed to the bottom of my rack. Running in stereo makes a BIG difference so as Chamai said it's the best way to go. Start simple and bring in things as you experiment.Some things to keep in mind:The MP1 loop uses a dual ganged opposing pot, so as you increase the send it decreases the return and vis versa. Don't mix line level and inst level devices in the loop. Best just use one device say the eq, that's probably a good spot for it or maybe the DOD FX96?.You need a stereo power amp, the Microtube (which is a hybrid amp, tube input SS output) would work well, is 1RU, not too heavy and not too loud.Either get another cab or re-wire you 4x12 so it can be stereo. Thus it will handle 60w per side which will match well with the Microtube (or a 50w per ch amp e.g. a Carvin TS100).Delay and Rev are best after the MP1, you can chain through it in stereo (some call it the 4 cable method) and mix your wet/dry balance in the FX (Intelliflex is good, or Quadverb etc). OR if you use a mixer, use one FX send L and one R and return into 2 channels pan L & R.
Wah is best up front as would be the MXR boost.Let us know how you go and what works for you... Also there's lots of posts here about what others have found good for them.
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Ok,some things I've learned the last few months:
It blows my mind how versatile this unit is.... soooo many tones you can get out of this thing :metal:
My unit may not be working as it should. There is a really strong hum when od 1/od 2/ master gain are all above 7. I took pics of the inside, MJMP has said my noise mod is only 1/2 done so that may be it.
Not sure if there is a need for a mixer with my Intelifex LTD.... apparently the intellifex units mix the effects into your analog signal path and only a/d - d/a converts it if you engage the hush. I really can't tell a difference with the hush in or out but I haven't had it at live volume yet. Some of the preset effects are way too much, but I was told for best results dial the presets down. I have a midi editor & cable and downloaded some user made presets I can drop in there. It appears that the intellifex power supply (an AC transformer) causes some hum when plugged in near the rest of the stuff.
Still trying to figure out the best uses of the clean tube channel
I'll try the dod delay & EQ pedals in the loop and report back. The Wah upfront is good, almost too wide a sweep but I can tame that with the knob on the pedal. The micro amp up front seems to just add hair (a third gain stage?) and not really any volume boost. I will also try it in the loop.
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Still looking into power amp options. The ones that made my 1U list are Mesa 20/20 (can't seem to find even one for sale), Marshall 20/20 (even rarer than the Mesa if that is possible), Engl 810/20 (tons of features but it will run me almost $1000), Garland 40x2 (these look nice but they are basically custom made by a guy in Bulgaria and there may be a wait list). I would like to buy one made here in the US but don't know who makes them like the guy in Bulgaria.
If I go 2U then a used peavey 50/50 would probably do it... volume presence & resonance for each channel $350 or so. The ADA T100 is an option as well.
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The 2 Carvin options are also worth considering, 1RU DCM 200L or if you don't mind the weight the TS100 2RU all tube. The ADA T100s are quite rare and twice the weight of the Carvin TS100. ADA B200s come up from time to time
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So another question to everyone... what's the real deal with power conditioners? Glorified power strip surge protectors or something more? Worthy of a rack slot?
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There was discussion about this quite a while ago, if you search around you'll find the thread. Some here like them and use them. The only time I've needed something like that is when the power is from a small generator so I bought and use a 1KVA UPS (like they sell for home office computer setups). The UPS were around $150 - $200 AUD back then. A Furman was over $500 (and there's not much inside it). If you don't have any mains noise, you probably don't need one. That said, my MP2 doesn't like fluctuating power. The mains power in Australia is very good so it depends what the power supply is like where you are (and play). If you really want/need good clean power then a balanced power supply (like they use for studios etc.) is the best (all the mains noise is phase cancelled) but that probably won't fit in your rack.
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Well I have a furman in my rack and it's more than a glorified power strip, it has a filter plus a protection circuit that monitors the voltage coming in, so if the voltage is too high it won't start.
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I read that thread all the way through... it veered from conditioners to ground loop hum. When It comes to rack power conditioners (speaking of Furman) they come in many prices with different "features". Will a $75 one work? Or do you go for the $300 one?
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I have a pl plus series II, I have it for 10 years now without any issues. I think I payed 225 euro for it 10 years ago. The 75$ ones are glorified power strips.
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I agree with the mixer, I got an old Rane SM26 and it is a cooler way to run effects then doing everything in series and having all the AD/DA conversions. The tone is purer, and it sounds much bigger. I like my VHT 2/50/2 power amp but I hear the 2/90/2 and the Mesa 2:90 are pretty epic for used tube power amps.
I'm also running a Rane PE-15 directly after the MP1 for further tone sculpting if necessary. Then I run the stereo outs from the mixer into a MPE-14 to do any real fine tuning. It's a little over kill but I like having all the control. I would run old Eventide harmonizers but I picked up a pitch factor to do detune and it's awesome. Throw in your favorite stereo digital delay and it's 80's time. Using 2 4x12's you can even be whisper quiet and get a good tone, but I like cranking it a little.
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I don't think I need a mixer. For effects I'm running an Intellifex LTD which is analog thru so it mixes the effects into the signal path. I was wondering if there was a power conditioner on the floor I could buy to save a rack space.
Also, I have read a trick was to use a parametric EQ pre distortion to sound huge, but I'm not sure how this would work with the MP 1.
Also, what order do I put this stuff in the rack?
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When I had an original MP-1 I used a boss GE-7 (reversed smiley) on the input of the MP-1. A bit noisy but worked like a charm. A boss PQ-4 works also fine but these are a bit hard to find.
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I was wondering if there was a power conditioner on the floor I could buy to save a rack space. I use a computer UPS, you'd need a 1KVA. They have a battery in them so they are a bit heavy but they are also much cheaper than a furman. Get one that decouples the power, so you always run off the battery and it is always charging.
I'd put the MP1 at the top so the heat from the tubes can dissipate, then the inteliflex and power amp on the bottom.
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What about a BBB maximized or an Aphex Exciter? I know people had these in their racks back in the day. I have the pedal versions of both and I kinda like them, but other people hate them.
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Whatever works for you, you could have them in front of the MP1 or in the MP1 loop, in the loop lets you switch them in/out in the MP1 patch, in front you'd have to stomp them on/off. Every gadget you put in the signal chain will add noise, affect (reduce) the dynamic range and also you need to get the gain structure right. My preference is keep it all simple and make the sounds with my fingers, also I'm not chasing a particularly "processed" sound. IIRC Aphex started life as an aural exciter designed to make vocals stand out in a mix (as they add lots of upper harmonics). I don't know much about the BBB maximizer stuff but other members here use them I think :dunno: . Basically you need to try it and see/hear if it enhances your tone to your taste. Although my advice would be get your tone(s) sorted first (at stage volume), then add things in one by one and compare.