ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear
ADA Preamps => Original MP-1 => Topic started by: rabidgerry on May 24, 2015, 05:18:59 AM
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So I tried the stock MP1 I own out on my live rig yesterday.
It was a lot better than the first time. This has a lot to do with the arrangement of my cabinets in my practice room. Regardless, I have them in a better arrangement and coupling is not an issue anymore!! The first time I used the MP1 with my setup I got nothing but feedback.
This time was a better story :) However finessing will be required
So yesterday I hooked it up into my Boss GT5 loop. This worked great (so bizarre it never worked before without crazy issues).
The patch I was using was for my more non thrashy sounding numbers, the more regular heavy metal songs. I think my patch was:
od1: 7.5
od2:6.5 (this was 7.5 but I was getting too much bass and the bass was already -6 so I lowered this and increased bass on the EQ to -2)
Master: 5
Bass: -2
Mid: -6
Treble: 4 (this may have been 6 at one point and I lowered it)
Presence: 8
The results I liked. I will play about over the next few weeks. Issues I encountered were too much bass and mids. I felt like I was having to make massive cuts. I wanted to cut the mids more but one more step down to -8 suddenly was way to much.
What I would like to achieve over the next few weeks:
To get a thashier sound - I'm not sure I can do this on the mp1 by itself. I have boosts at my disposal so I'm going to employ them starting with an analogue overdrive module on my GT5. I give it whirl yesterday but I got feedback that was a little too wild. Tinkering may solve the issue. I can also just add a clean boost.
To get make use of an EQ with the MP1: I found the onboard EQ with my setup very limiting, perhaps I can add more detailed EQ using the GT5 parametric EQ.
All in all I thought it went well. It was nice to get using it in a non di recording environment. Hopefully this is the start of the MP1 becoming a full time member of my squad ;D
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Hey RG, the MP1 is very much a live preamp, it works quite well though with the GCS3 cab sim in the loop for recording, my inclination wood be make it the centre of your tone an use the rest to bolster (apply FX) to it..
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Yes I agree so I put it in the fx loop of my boss and it worked well as the preamp in that chain.
I don't need a cab sim for recording though as I have the EPSI which is the best cab sim I have ever heard. I looked at the GCS3 a while back but I'll never switch now that I have the ability to load any speaker on the planet. I can even make my own should I choose to run a sine wav though my live rig and record the output.
But that's of the beaten track again.
MP1 trials our in full swing, hopefully can nestle it into my live setup and I can get the sounds I need from it. Tweaking!!
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Started this thread a while ago and never really updated it. Perhaps because I hadn't fully experimented with the mp1 PROPERLY in my live rig. Well I've had it set up now for a while and I've went back and forth from it and the Peavey Rockmaster and I finally seemed to stumble upon ground from which I can start to may be build a few more sounds (I only really need a handful).
So this week I played a whole practice session with the MP1 and it was f**king awesome I have to say. No BOOST for extra gain! I couldn't believe it. I didn't find I needed it but I think I will play about with using one just for a little more variety, and more thrashy numbers.
Anyways the setting I used
OD1 6.5
OD2 6
Master Vol 5.5
Bass -2
Mid 0
Trebel 2
Presence 4
I was in heaven today, it was awesome with the axe I was using with it (blue Squier Showmaster with DP100 in bridge).
It was so smooth, responsive, had detail (and this was using what ever the stock tubes are), and grunt.
I also use this MP1 with a step down transformer as it's a Yank model. It sounded superb to me.
Used it in conjunction with Boss GT5, had patches where a Chorus was on permanently (just for stereo effect) and also for a more dominant colouration and I used a harmonizer with it also and some Delay and Reverb from time to time.
Very happy. I will try and get a few clips together. I personally find I get better results with guitar recording through DI approach using my cab sim.
Really love the unit. I would buy another if they were not at stupid prices that they seem to have gone up to.
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:whoohoo!: Go RG, MP1 heaven, I loved the stock tubes BTW (if that's what you've got, there's no brand on them and they lasted for a very long time).
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I'm planning on getting a mdrt for it................but I'd lose the compressed feel right? And I think I loved that yesterday lol
Yeah these are the stock ones I think. Just a bit of red type on them but no brand of any sort.
SC sent me the TAD RT001 to try out as that's the one closest the original Chinese valves. Looking forward to trying them.
I know you all are wondering why it's taken me so long but rather than rock the boat I stick with the "if it's not broke don't fix it attitude" in regards to my set up before using anything rack. And I would never risk trying out a new piece of gear until I heard what it was like with my live setup very, very loud and for at least a sets length amount of time. I wouldn't want to risk showing up to a gig and having f*cked up feedback issues or something random. I've learnt my lesson before the hard way doing that.
So it's battle tested as far as I can see. I discovered output A has died, or at least is intermittent so I shall need to replace. Just used output B yesterday.
PS why are 1/2 U rack cases so f**king dear!!!! I wanna get a smaller case so I can still travel quite light to gigs rather than take my larger rack case.
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PS why are 1/2 U rack cases so f**king dear!!!! I wanna get a smaller case so I can still travel quite light to gigs rather than take my larger rack case.
Top bang-for-the-buck 2u rack, I can highly recommend these:
http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm (http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm)
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Hey SC, cool cases :thumb-up:
@RG, yeah that sounds like the original Chinese tubes. I don't know that the MDRT will ruin the compressed feel you have ? I'll be able to tell better when we put one in MikeBs MP1, but from what I've read about them they will enhance things without wrecking them. Sounds like time to replace the jacks on the back panel, to get at them you have to undo all the jacks and get the back plate off, so if you are going to replace ch A output jack you may as well do them all (MJMP has the appropriate jack sockets). This is another maintenance mod we'll do on MikeBs MP1 when we do the MDRT, he's already bought all the jacks from MJMP.
Totally agree about making sure it's all sorted at volume before taking it live, I worked my MP1 into my rig slowly when I bought it way back for just that reason (and I had to save up for a B200s LoL and convert my then Yamaha quad box to stereo). Very happy when I transitioned to it though.
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PS why are 1/2 U rack cases so f**king dear!!!! I wanna get a smaller case so I can still travel quite light to gigs rather than take my larger rack case.
Top bang-for-the-buck 2u rack, I can highly recommend these:
http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm (http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm)
f*ck me! Those cases are an excellent price.
SC I look on the Thomann website a lot as you know, I have never come across these? Are these new?
Richard,
I only, mentioned about the MDRT and the compressed hing because I heard that is what they did, was changed that feel as well as enhance. I asked MJMP to hold me one over anyways. If I sold a few things on ebay I'd snap one up sooner, just with Christmas n all and axes needing work done I'm shelling out all over the place!!
I have jacks for the rear outputs on my mp1 that fit so I shall replace A when I get a chance. It may just need cleaned, but I reckon replacing will be the ticket. Out B works fine so I aint gonna bother replacing it.
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PS why are 1/2 U rack cases so f**king dear!!!! I wanna get a smaller case so I can still travel quite light to gigs rather than take my larger rack case.
Top bang-for-the-buck 2u rack, I can highly recommend these:
http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm (http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm)
f*ck me! Those cases are an excellent price.
SC I look on the Thomann website a lot as you know, I have never come across these? Are these new?
I bought one in May in order to rack up my 11R and they already had them listed for quite some time then...
Defo qualifies as carry-on/cabin luggage size-/weight-wise
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Aha!
I may have snared a 2u Rack case for way cheaper!! Just want I am after.
Guys how much ventilation do you give your mp1? Is its ok to have pre and power on top of one another? I've seen this done a lot or just two rack pieces together without any spaces but I always wonder isn't there a danger of possibly cooking a unit doing this?
I may live in a cold shithole but in a venue it will get warm with the lights and such.
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Hey RG, good question, you can have the poweramp and MP1 on top, I've not heard of any issues. I put MP2 as top in rack (gives some ventilation above) but I've always run FX underneath and poweramp down the bottom (now in it's own 2RU case). Considerations for me, B200s is really hot on top (as that's what the output transistors are mounted to), MP2 run really hot also (so not keen to make the to close). MP1 isn't as hot as MP2, so not as big an issue and will probably be fine. But I'd proffer that a Carvin DCM200L (1 RU) in a 2 RU rack with MP1/2 would be fine.
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I was going to say Richard, I don't think the MP1 does run that hot. It does heat up but I wouldn't say it gets burny hot, like a marshall I used to have - then cut out.
So if I stuck my mp one on top with a rack power amp 1u on bottom and had a nice neat 2u case I would be ok?
Well I trust you much more MP1 experienced guys with this.
I am really looking forward to playing the MP1 again this week. Was making recording backing tracks using MP1 3TM this week. Using the cheapo $18 dollar pup. Guess what? Totally different less thin sound. Results will be posted. Also going to show off some harmonist tones I get from the BOSS GT5, but I'll post that on Kims thread about pitch shiftyness :thumb-up:
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Hey RG, what you propose will be fine, the MP1s don't run as hot as MP2s, but even then you can put an MP2 on top of a B200s (they get hot on top) and it's fine. Maybe just adjust the top unit up and bottom unit down to get the best separation for air flow. My understanding is they were designed to be deployed just like what you want without any overheating issues.
I was thinking (and almost said) in previous post re $18 PUs that a solution may be "use MP1 >:D ", glad it's working out for you :thumb-up: Got to get channel A sorted though, once you have ADA MP1/2 in stereo, very hard to go back (only if you have to..)
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PS why are 1/2 U rack cases so f**king dear!!!! I wanna get a smaller case so I can still travel quite light to gigs rather than take my larger rack case.
Top bang-for-the-buck 2u rack, I can highly recommend these:
http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm (http://www.thomann.de/ie/boschma_cases_2u_he_shallow_case.htm)
bagged a 2U for real cheap of ebay. Don't think it wa selling because it was for collection only. So I said to the guy I'll buy it and send a courier to collect it myself. It's in pretty much perfect condition. Seems VERY deep, compared with my 3U case.
£20 it cost - then £7.50 courier :thumb-up: cannot be bad to that!!! Bargain!
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Hey RG, rack cases come in different depths, but the main 2 I've seen is short, fine if your units aren't very deep and handle MP1/2 fine, or deep, a bit longer to fit deeper units. One advantage of deeper racks is room for a powerboard etc. but then they are larger. When I was buying a smallish rack to put PA stuff in, I went back to the shop 3 times to get it right as the dual 31 band eq is older and deeper and I needed 6 RU but started with a 4 RU :facepalm: then decided to put more shit in it.
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ok so been playing this at rehearsal for a few weeks now properly and I'm loving it. Did my first gig with it on Saturday.
Couldn't help feel it was a little too polite though than what I use normally for some of the faster thrashier number. It's sweet and tasty and has all the nice stuff but I felt I was missing crunch in the distortion area. It also fed back way more than it does in our rehearsal room so sticking an OD infront from the Boss GT5 will probably make it even more of a feedback bitch live.
Peavey Rockmaster with shed loads more distortion has no issues like this and it was at the same venue. I could control MP1s feedback but just about. And that probably rules out adding another gain stage.
Here is proof i used it!! I felt proud using it :) I know it makes me a legend tone chasing headbanger from Ireland using the MP1.
(http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k114/themetalmartyr/12301685_10153281213795949_4074537430736549775_n.jpg) (http://s86.photobucket.com/user/themetalmartyr/media/12301685_10153281213795949_4074537430736549775_n.jpg.html)
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I don't have a GT-5 but doesn't it have a built in noise suppressor in the global menu? If not or if it isn't very good add a boss NS2 or ISP decimator. With my NS2 I can gain stage my boss eq> Boss SD1 > TS9 > amp input. It quiets all hum and feedback from pick ups to amp input. You could also run it in the loop of the MP1 if that is your cause of feedback. There are a few ways you can route it, one way you can have it up front and in the loop.
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Oh it does man, and I have it on. But I don't care what anyone says, any noise reduction device no matter how good, if the threshold is up to high it eats into the tone. I can't remember what I have mine set at for those patches I use for external preamps going via the loop. Might be quite low, so may be I can bump it up a little more. I try never to go past 50 (out of a range of 100).
I was thinking perhaps the tubes were done since it is the originals in my mp1 and they've lasted for 2o something years and also taken a plane ride across the Atlantic. Might be time to change them.
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50 is quite low,mostly my gates are at 70 to 80%.Another problem might be the setup you use MP-1 with the GT-5,too many wires.An all rack setup is better so you can go straight into the mp-1.
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I run my threshold about 65-70% for higher gain patches, I still get nice delay repeats and no choked tone.
I agree an improperly set gate will castrate the balls off your tone! :facepalm:
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Of course a gate too high will kill it all. I'd never put it behind a delay though as it would defo kill that. Soloist do you put your gate at the end of the chain? I only stick it after the preamp or what ever it is that causes distortion.
MJMP, perhaps it's the cables, but as I mention I use it ok at band practice, and I use other rack gear with higher settings than the MP1 fine as well. Also the patch isn't extreme hi gain, well I don't think so. I thought I had posted it on here I will check.
SC actually suggested doing the noise mod. I might look into that and replace the tubes that are about 26-7 years old probably.
EDIT: Here is the patch
OD1 6.5
OD2 6
Master Vol 5.5
Bass -2
Mid 0
Trebel 2
Presence 4
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Is this the 3TM or the standard mp-1 you have?
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Of course a gate too high will kill it all. I'd never put it behind a delay though as it would defo kill that. Soloist do you put your gate at the end of the chain? I only stick it after the preamp or what ever it is that causes distortion.
Well......I actually run 2 gates. The first gate is an NS2 it is first in my signal chain. My dirt pedals run thru it's loop. My second gate is the one built into my G Major2 and it is last in the chain before my power amp. The second gate I only use for extreme high gain patches with a really low setting. However the second gain is before my effects. So gate 1 covers my pick ups and OD pedals, gate 2 covers my preamps gain. Kinda screwy but it works great.
You patch is not extreme gain. I don't need to gate my MP-1 until OD1 or OD is above 8 or my Master is at 8.5 or higher.
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Is this the 3TM or the standard mp-1 you have?
I have both, did you forget?
But I am talking about the standard here. 3TM is staying in studio until the time is right :thumb-up:One thing at a time I say.
Of course a gate too high will kill it all. I'd never put it behind a delay though as it would defo kill that. Soloist do you put your gate at the end of the chain? I only stick it after the preamp or what ever it is that causes distortion.
Well......I actually run 2 gates. The first gate is an NS2 it is first in my signal chain. My dirt pedals run thru it's loop. My second gate is the one built into my G Major2 and it is last in the chain before my power amp. The second gate I only use for extreme high gain patches with a really low setting. However the second gain is before my effects. So gate 1 covers my pick ups and OD pedals, gate 2 covers my preamps gain. Kinda screwy but it works great.
You patch is not extreme gain. I don't need to gate my MP-1 until OD1 or OD is above 8 or my Master is at 8.5 or higher.
I'm not saying my setup is very basic, but your set up is way too complex for me.
It's bad enough having to set up stuff for stereo never mind have two seperate gates to work. I find it really hard to get what I use on and off the stage in 15minute as it is. Perhaps yopu have longer for band change over in the USA? If I had all night to set up at gigs I wouldn't give a f*ck. No road crew either so it's all about getting on as fast as possible, and getting off just as fast. Festivals it's even more crucial. And it's not helped when the other band is trying to set up their shit on top of you!
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It's not as complicated as it looks. I have 3 gate settings stored in my GM2, I run through each real quick during sound check and then I know which to use for that venue. 1 rack, 1 pedalboard, 2 2x12 cabs. 8 cables(2 speaker,1 midi,4 inst. 1 wireless.)Sets up in under 10 minutes without any roadies. :metal:
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It's not as complicated as it looks. I have 3 gate settings stored in my GM2, I run through each real quick during sound check and then I know which to use for that venue. 1 rack, 1 pedalboard, 2 2x12 cabs. 8 cables(2 speaker,1 midi,4 inst. 1 wireless.)Sets up in under 10 minutes without any roadies. :metal:
lol set up in 10mins?
Bullshit!! I don't believe you :lol:
It is venue dependent I guess as some places are easy to get to. Some places do not have any backstage area and your literally carrying gear through the crowd and also some drummers don't have as many cymbals and stands as our drummer.
I dunno how long it takes me really but it's generally a 15min change over in UK so I get it done within this time. I don't throw anything off stage (not even a cable) either ;D
It's still tight sometimes as other bands are f**king about!
I have about 6 x cables, not including speaker cables for cabs so add another 2 and thats 8 cables. 2 x amps either side of the stage plus 2 power cables. 1 x floor FX unit with control pedal seperate and now a rack unit. Is that more or the same as you?
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yeah that's about the same. The only time it takes me longer is for an outdoor venue. :facepalm: It also helps that we usually go on last, set up is quick and we can take our time with tear down. Keep in mind I do not set up all the stacks only my rig. On really large gigs it takes a lot longer.
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Jeez what kind of venues do you play man that their are tables and chairs at the front? Normally see them if any at the back or sides.
You go on last mostly? So are you guys big then and paid your dues already moving up the ranks?
It depends with us. If we're supporting big touring bands locally then of course we go on before. It really depends. At our single launch obviously it will be us last but despite having played for nearly ten years in Ireland it's taken so long to even get recognised here and our country is a foot note compared to your country. We had to fight through about 5-6 years of extreme metal being the favoured style over here before we even started to get praise. Then suddenly we supported Hell at an indoor festival type show case a few years ago and suddenly things started to look up. Still a lot of shit we have to put up with usually though.
No pay, no backstage area, playing second fiddle to shite bands lol.
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That's the Whiskey River Saloon, we were there in September. Med size bar, 495 person capacity. I thought the tables up front was odd, usually it's a dance floor or mosh pit... :metal: anyways the tables were gone by the second song.
We've been hammering this area hard since about 92, so were well known..... locally at least. :lol:
It took us a while to get any support and recognition, we just kept plugging away.
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That's a decent sized capacity. About the same as where I played last saturday which is about 500.
Varies capacity wise from 200 to 500 in some places. You're lucky if you get 50 people though. And that's not just us, that's touring bands also. It's so small over here that a big band might pay on Friday and then by Monday another big band might play the same place but gets less of a crowd because everyone has spent all their money for the month going to the first gig. It suck.
It's usually the local bands that suffer from the big shows a few days before though as everyone will go to see the bigger, more established acts and then give the local stuff they normally come to see a miss because of again the money etc. If you're the local band though and on the support slot for the bigger band then you get to enjoy that prestiege. Again it's so small here that it might not even get a great turn out unless you're Justin Bieber :facepalm:
On Saturday I might try some new tubes in the MP1 and see what the story is. I'll stick in an A and B Bugera since I know they sound to my liking at least in a 3tm.
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I didnt want to say anything, but are those bass cabs behind the drummer in the wrong place?
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Due to stage size that's where they fit. Picture is deceiving though, there is about 2 and half feet between the bass cabs and drum riser.
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I didnt want to say anything, but are those bass cabs behind the drummer in the wrong place?
El I dunno your amount of experience playing live in a band, but in my experience, I have seen some f*cked up positioning of equipment. Some really dangerous, some really stupid, and some really just pointless. But a lot of things are stage dependent.
When it doesn't make sense on stage sometimes that's why there is a sound man to correct it out front.
In saying that, Soloist, I know it's a lot cooler to play with all those stacks, but for practicality at the end of the day would you not have taken a guitar stack away from each side to allow those two bass cabs more room?
The only time I see that amount of cabs for guitars at much bigger venues or else open air festivals.
Don't get me wrong I like excess lol or perhaps some of them are props?
Also where are the mics and monitors out front? Mind you the guitarist will not need monitors by the amount of speakers already :lol:
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ok so never mind the tubes and the feedback issue.
The hum and buzz I'm getting from the unit is a little too much for my taste. I'm relegating the MP1 to the bench until I get that sorted out.
I use a step down transformer and MJMP told me to check one time to see if the earth pin was actually connected in case that is the issue. But I remember moving to a different plug outlet in our rehearsal room and that seemed to quieten down the "noise". But I am thinking it's still too much. No wonder it goes bezerk with a pedal in front of it with all that shit in the signal.
Just for clarity my Peavey Rockmaster connected the same way does not make as much noise. How I have made my comparisons was simply by connecting everything up and leaving it. So not touching the guitar or strings.
Plug in the MP1, noise and hum even using a humbucker. On single coils the signal to noise ratio is insanely bad.
Plug in the Rockmaster, much quieter, may be even completely quiet on the humbucker, and then just the expected amount of noise using single coils.
Have to do something about this.
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Well first you need to see what is the MP-1 noise level and what's so called outside noise.Just plug in the mp-1 but don't plug anything into the input.The noise you are getting this way is the noise generated by the mp-1 itself.Now plug in your guitar,all the noised added is comming from your cables,guitar,interference from other stuff like transformers,neon lights etc....
There are a few ways to lower the noise level of the mp-1.
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In saying that, Soloist, I know it's a lot cooler to play with all those stacks, but for practicality at the end of the day would you not have taken a guitar stack away from each side to allow those two bass cabs more room?
Don't get me wrong I like excess lol or perhaps some of them are props?
Also where are the mics and monitors out front? Mind you the guitarist will not need monitors by the amount of speakers already :lol:
Well, first off there already is 1 less stack per side. No props on this gig, didn't have excess space to fill. Good eye on the monitors this was the first time we tried in-ear monitors. I think the were Westone or something. I did not like them at all. I will be going back to floor monitors. The singer had the mics and stands and of course was late to set up.(as usual) :facepalm:
Even with the bass cabs tucked in our sound was enormous. So it was a non-issue.
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The noise floor on my MP1 is higher than my other preamps as well. If I don't max od1/od2 or the master it is controllable. I don't use my MP1 for ultra hi gain. Hard rock 80's type gain and cleans are what I use it for. Maiden type distortion, and plexi/jcm800 tones from my JMP. Ultra hi gain from voodoo valve or piranha :metal:
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Well first you need to see what is the MP-1 noise level and what's so called outside noise.Just plug in the mp-1 but don't plug anything into the input.The noise you are getting this way is the noise generated by the mp-1 itself.Now plug in your guitar,all the noised added is comming from your cables,guitar,interference from other stuff like transformers,neon lights etc....
There are a few ways to lower the noise level of the mp-1.
This makes sense of course! That will be the first test I do. Then gradually start connecting stuff up.
The reason I jump to the conclusion I do is because A/B 'd with another pre it's worse and that's using exactly the same settings on the accommodating FX pedal that uses the pre's in the loop.
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The noise floor on my MP1 is higher than my other preamps as well. If I don't max od1/od2 or the master it is controllable. I don't use my MP1 for ultra hi gain. Hard rock 80's type gain and cleans are what I use it for. Maiden type distortion, and plexi/jcm800 tones from my JMP. Ultra hi gain from voodoo valve or piranha :metal:
I know what ya mean, I guess my patch isn't really hi gain though and still noisey.
I like to think I could get away with the stock MP1 and more gain but perhaps not. I'd really like to get to a point where I can use it with a pedal in front for more thrasy style gain. I still think it sounds nice. Everyone said it was good sounding the other week at the gig I used it at.
But lets get to noise issue before anything else.
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Hey Gerry I just remembered something, are using the front or rear input of your MP1? I ask because I was using my front input. One day out of the blue it became obnoxiously noisy, so after dicking around with cables and shit I tried the rear input. Instantly dropped the noise level. So my front input went bad. I never replaced it, I still use the rear input to this day. If that one goes I will have no choice but to replace them. So try the other input, if no change at least you eliminated the inputs from the equation. :thumb-up:
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Just make sure when using the rear input it's a V2 model,V1 have a line in at the rear,so not for use with passive pickups.
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ok then I must have a V2! Cause mine works awesome.
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Ahhhhhhhh the old line in rear input :o.
Well the first mp1 I bought was a v1 AND I of course did the input Mod successfully albeit with some free styled parts (I used a stagg stereo jack as opposed to a switchcraft).
But I sold this as it sounded like a dead donkey.
Then I bought 3TM, all good in the hood!
Then I went, what da f*ck lets by another MP1 as it's cheap! So this is the MP1 in question and it whether has the Mod done to it or else it's a V2 as both are usable for guitars and passive pups.
I think it might be a V2. I can't remember if it has the switch on top for line level switching on the loop or not.
Anyways I have been going in via the front input. I'll try the rear and see if it makes a difference. My guess is it's noisey, BUT it's also being used with a step down transformer that may not have an actual functioning earth pin.
I'll do the noise by itself test using only MP1
Then test the front and rear inputs.
Then test the earth Pin on the transformer
I did notice that when I moved it from plug outlet that a mixer and whole pile of other stuff was plugged into it reduced the noise a little. Still bad compared to the other pre.
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When you do the noise mod replace 4 33µF caps on the tubeboard to 10µF/50V (C16,12,7,6).This also helps to get the hum down.As for noise replace the 4 100k anode resistors with metal film resistors.(R6,5,3,2).
V1 mp-1 always have the topswitch.
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In regards to the top switch, yeah I know about that, I just cannot remember for the life of me does it have one!
Either way it's not important as I know I can use either the front and rear input on that MP1.
MJMP i messaged you about the noise mod kit.
I still want to go through the checks though and see if we can establish the noise situation a little better.
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Top switch is for line/inst level on the main outs (to plug into guitar amp inputs (inst) or power amp inputs (line)), nothing to do with the loop ( I can't remember if it has the switch on top for line level switching on the loop or not.) The loop copes with line/inst level by using a dual gang pot wired so turning it up turns the other down etc.
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Well I knew it switched something round the back but it's of no use to me either way.
I wonder what my 3TM is set to, must check it while the cover is off.
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Hey RG
Your 3TM should be a lot more quiet then the original,is this so in your case?
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I've not tried the 3TM on my live setup. Once I get a chance to do the testing I will try that also.
I've a gig in Dublin this weekend and then we're shooting a music video for the new single so I may not get a chance to do it this weekend.
I'll start by doing al the basic tests with the MP1 first then try the 3TM.
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Hey RG, hope the gig and video shoot goes well :thumb-up: :wave:
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The gig went great! 50 minute set!! Didn't use the MP1 though. Used the Peavey Rockmaster instead.
Before I left for the gig, I tested the MP1 a little bit. I plugged into the MP1, and only the MP1. I connected this to my power amps. So it was
guitar > MP1 > Amp > cabs
(usually it's this guitar > Boss GT5 > Boss send to MP1 > MP1 out to Boss Return > Boss Out > Amp > cabs)
Still noise. Albeit different than when it's connected to my FX pedal (in the loop). I couldn't quite tell if it was worse than when it was in the FX pedla loop or not.
So I don't think the pedal setup is the problem. But of course it will add some extra noise as every device will.
@ Soloist I also checked the front and rear input, no difference in noise from what I can hear.
And for the record I now know I have a V2 as no switch on top.
I never got a chance to test the earth on the transformer.
On a seperate note, I noticed my amps are making more noise these days by themselves, could this be part of the issue? In which case should I switch out the electrolytic caps? The amps are may be a little over ten years old. I didn't remember them humming until a few months ago.
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anyone know whether my amps might be adding noise or not? (see above post)
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Normally power amps don't add noise.
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That's what I'm trying to find out, does the hum from the amp affect the sound? I'm trying to figure out if the amps hum (sounds like the transformer noise to me).
I don't think it is the cause of the MP1's noise but I am wondering is it a contributing factor.
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going to try a different amp today to see if it makes any difference.
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ok some bizarre findings today.
First off I did not use the MP1 until later. But before I did use it, I took the two amps I play through normally and plugged them into one socket at one side of the room. Then I plugged the preamp I was using at the time into an extension lead that runs to the plugs on the other side of the room. I noticed a lot less hum.
Sooooooooooooo later on then I decided to try MP1 out. Not as much noise. I would still say it has noise but more of a normal amount of noise if you understand me. So this was great! Since I found a little less noise I decided to pay it for a few hours. I did so and realised perhaps the initial patch I was using wasn't %100
great either. So I was flicking through what ever had been saved on the MP1. I found two patches that actually sounded a lot higher gain than the patch I was using. It was pretty cool. I noticed a lot less noise also. So this was even more pleasing. The only thing I didn't feel some of the hi gain patches I discovered could do was thrashy tone. So I began trying a boost using a OD module on my GT5. Early days but I might actually get away with using one in front and not having awful feedback issues.
All this seems to be down to the fact less noise was in the signal and the patches I discovered pre programmed must have been designed better than the one I was using as they seemed a lot quieter yet had more gain on same occasions on OD1 AND OD2.
Anyways watch this space.
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Hey RG,
I reckon you've got a leprechaun in your power supply ... do you use a power conditioner/filter for your rig? Something that can reduce the noise from electromagnetic and radio frequency (EMI and RFI)?
It's been known for leprechauns to cause noisy interference, voltage fluctuations and electrical surges ;D
(http://www.cybercletch.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/iStock_leprechaun_Small-155x220.jpg)
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Hi DR,
no I don't use one of those. I did look into it a while back. I was lead to believe it was an unnecessary piece of gear. I read a lot that supported the theories against power conditioners and I also read a lot of people who used them and liked them but couldn't really back it up.
When you say leprechaun/gremlin, what exactly do ya mean :???:
The reason I ask is because I'm sure the electrics in our rehearsal room + entire premises are just :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: :poop: and pretty much responsible for a lot of that rubbish I hear and the reason I want you to be more specific is in case you think there is something wrong with a bit of my gear (which I am currently lead to believe there is not)
so let me know man :thumb-up:
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So, your hum level decreases when you tried plugging into a different socket in the room? My first thought was quality of mains power ... hence using a power conditioner/filter. Do you have access to one, or borrow one perhaps?
EDIT: Just a thought ... did you try plugging both your amps and the preamp into the other socket at the same time? Did the hum come back again?
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This topic has been split to "Power Conditioners" and moved to Rack Gear (http://adadepot.com/index.php?board=14.0).
http://adadepot.com/index.php?topic=1340.0 (http://adadepot.com/index.php?topic=1340.0)
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Yes it was secretly bothering me that we went off on a major topic detour!
Anyways I'll continue to update this with my experimentation and integration into my rig.
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So yeah, more trials today and with a new power amp. MP1 sounds great. But I have worked something out. When some asshole somewhere in the building switches something on below me I think, I get noise fest!
Noise fest I say. So there are more forces at work here in the noise problems I have been having. It's not just a case of switching to two separate outlets, it's probably wiring from lights below me causing me hell (even though my guitar is shielded)
I'm also trying to work out if I am getting enough gain from the MP1. I think I am actually. Is that weird? I do think it needs layered with a pedal before it though for thrashy stuff. When I say that I mean, dial out some gain on the MP1 then put an OD or something in front also with very very light dirt on there, then suddenly super tight low end and the rest of the tone is easy with the EQ on the MP1. I noticed the MP1 takes big jumps between numbers on it's eq. So say going from 0 to -2 on the mid can really be enough of a scoop, where as dropping it another one notch is just way too much. Same goes for bass treble and presence.
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I always found that the original mp-1 needed some sort of mid boost for higher gain settings to get a tight sound.The 3TM doesn't need this at all.
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I always found that the original mp-1 needed some sort of mid boost for higher gain settings to get a tight sound.
What freqs are you talking about exactly? I want to try it out,
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I always found that the original mp-1 needed some sort of mid boost for higher gain settings to get a tight sound.
What freqs are you talking about exactly? I want to try it out,
The classic TS and all its derivates and reincarnations generally are centered somewhere along the 660-720Hz range.
Try out one of the OD blocks from the MPX-G2 and set it in the FX chain before the Insert (MP-1)
I personally like the "Crunch" one in the MPX-G2 best.
If you keep the normal TS controls in mind (Drive, Tone, Level), try something around
- Drive 9 o'clock
- Tone 10-11 o'clock
- Level 2 o'clock
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I always found that the original mp-1 needed some sort of mid boost for higher gain settings to get a tight sound.The 3TM doesn't need this at all.
Yes agreed on 3TM! As you say the 3TM has the extra built in.
Lets be clear, for me I find there is enough gain in stock MP1, may be they aren't all like my MP1 but it seems gainey enough for me. But it's perhaps not tight enough for the thrashy stuff as I say. But easily solved with a dirt box or EQ at the front. Just a question of managing everything so I don't get even more noise and uncontrollable feedback.
MJMP you know I considered changing my stock MP1 to a 3tm (you may remember me saying before). But I asked your advice and also my own thoughts and we arrived at the conclusion that perhaps keeping a stock MP1 would be nice also. And I am glad of this so I have one of each kind. And it is no trouble at all placing a pedal from my MFX infront of the MP1 at all. But I guess it will require careful setting up so both work in tandem with one another.
When you used to place a pedal in front (I don't know if you do this anymore since you are 3TM whore :lol:) what typical setting with the gain would you have on the MP1?
Anyone else has experience with adding a pedal please tell me you settings also, not the settings of the actual pedal in front but what the MP1 was set at itself. Good to have extra knowledge.
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Well in the early 90's i used a boss GE-7 in front of my original mp-1.Just a reversed smiley setting.It worked great but it had one downside and that was the clean sounds sounded too mid.And it ads quite a bit of extra noise.
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Hey Gerry, here are some settings I use:
OD1. OD2. MG. B. M. T. P. Depth. Rate
4. 5.5. 7.5. 12. 6. 6. 12. 20. 0.5
4. 5.5. 7.5. 9. 4. 6. 8. 30. 0.1
7. 5. 7. 12. -6. 9. 6. 74. 0.1
5. 5. 6.5. 6. 8. 6. 4. 20. 1.7
6.5. 7.5. 8. 9. -8. 0. 10. 0. 0
These with a GE7+ SD1 or GE7 + TS9 into front of MP1.
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Well in the early 90's i used a boss GE-7 in front of my original mp-1.Just a reversed smiley setting.It worked great but it had one downside and that was the clean sounds sounded too mid.And it ads quite a bit of extra noise.
That's what I use, however my GE 7 has the noise mod. Quiet as can be :thumb-up:
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Even though I have an EQ I could use for the front I don't think I would.
I have this pedal, yes it's chinese and it's excellent. Solid metal and great sound in my opinion. The price is not to be snubbed as it beats the plastic behringer pedals (although they sound ok do their pedals since they're boss clones)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Biyang-EQ7-Graphic-Pedal-Guitar/dp/B001U2DGUI (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Biyang-EQ7-Graphic-Pedal-Guitar/dp/B001U2DGUI)
I'd much rather use some form of drive. Like the OD i use in front which I guess is boss OD-1 (I say I guess because it's a drive module on my GT5 which are all analogue as often point out on here).
This provided the mids and other goodness that can't be explained lol I like to call it the "extra layer".
Hey solist thanks for those settings. So all those settings are compatible with a pedal of some form or another boosting from the front? Great I can't wait to use them.
Do you find those settings then with the pedal provide proper hi gain?
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Yes all settings used with pedals. I also use my rocktron pro q and the 3 band parametric eq in my gm2 to further shape the tone, but those will get you in the ballpark :thumb-up:
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Well for tube heads i prefer an overdrive pedal but for the mp-1 an EQ sounds better.BTW that looks like a GE-7 clone,it's gone exactly the same freq's.
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Oh yeah for sure it is a clone, you know what Chinese market is like MJMP. However its half the f**king price! And I know pedals construction. It's solid, and has solid jacks and slider are sweat. Sure that type can break off but so can the boss sliders.
EQ better in front of MP1 you say? You know you've made me curious? :o I shall try.
Although I do think that Boss OD works well, honest!! no drive added really, minimal setting and then about 50 on the level.
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I agree the Boss OD really adds some character to the tone, the tube screamer is more for a lead boost. Here is a pic of my eq and boss od settings. **Note the low drive level on the od, where as the TS9 drive is at 50% **
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Yeah that's not too far off my setting man. You've a little more dirt thrown in and a little less level. I'll perhaps try this and also with your patch settings. Thanks for that. I think I was very gentle bringing a pedal infront because previously I had so much shit and noise I just got insane feedback. Then I started to do things like move the plugs around etc. Hopeing the power conditioner purchase will clean up some bullshit I seem to get through my rig.
Anyways I'm going to try the EQ pedal through the MP1 also, although using the OD of the GT5 has been a favourite thing of mine since I discovered that unit. It's weird it has a lesser OD module, called "Natural Drive" and I thought I could perhaps use that as well, but not it sounded like shit. It was too loud or something and added no extra crunchey feel that the OD module does.
Looking forward to trying these ideas, that will be my gateway to more thrash level distortion with the MP1, and then I'll also have a different flavour altogether with my 3TM. And then I have my two Rock Masters!!
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Hey Gerry, here are some settings I use:
OD1. OD2. MG. B. M. T. P. Depth. Rate
4. 5.5. 7.5. 12. 6. 6. 12. 20. 0.5
4. 5.5. 7.5. 9. 4. 6. 8. 30. 0.1
7. 5. 7. 12. -6. 9. 6. 74. 0.1
5. 5. 6.5. 6. 8. 6. 4. 20. 1.7
6.5. 7.5. 8. 9. -8. 0. 10. 0. 0
These with a GE7+ SD1 or GE7 + TS9 into front of MP1.
Ok had a few hours deafening myself yesterday with the MP1. Tried all you OD1 and OD2 settings man. Probably settled on just two of them as the 6.5 - 7.5 setting didn't bring much more to the tone other than bit more noise and saturation. 4 - 5.5 seemed a good all rounder. I used my own EQing on the unit but next week I'll try yours.
I just used my own as I had a base patch already made up from when I tried an od in front before, then tweaked as I saw fit.
Well the results I'm very happy with, I got usable settings I think. I used the "vintage Overdrive" module on my GT5, this I guess is somewhere between a Boss OD-1 and OD-3. It's what I use normally in front as a gain boost. Worked a treat.
But then I tried the distortion modules which are based on the DS-1 and DS-2. Could not get anything good from using these, even very low at the front end. Utter horrid tone.
Then an accident occurred!!!!! Good accident :whoohoo!:. There is a crunch distortion on the GT5 and a Blues Driver. These create VERY smooth and natural drive sounds, and sound really great on their own since they are analogue. However I've never had a use for them myself, even as a boost for the amp sims on the pedal itself which I still think are good. Well I'm not sure what the "Crunch" is meant to be on the GT5 because I don't know of any Boss "Crunch" pedal, but I do know setting it at 50 on the drive, and about 35 on the level (so no actual volume boost pushes the MP1 front creating distortion that way) creates a really amazing flavoured hi gain!!! To me it reminded me of a DS-1 going into a Marshall or something like that. It really sounded great! And this for me was amazing as I love different distortion flavours. Next week I shall try and record some and see what ya'll think :)
I have yet to try EQ pedal of sorts in front of the MP1 but I shall.
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The higher od settings work good for me however they are tweaked using my pro Q, and the parametric eq and noise gate in the G major 2. I use my boss eq up front to boost the mids, then pull them out with the pro q and parametric. Its a bit tricky but has a nice thrashy tone!
The mid level od settings I use for anything from hard rock to "hair metal". Keep tweaking away you know as well as I every rig, guitar and guitar player is different. :thumb-up:
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Oh yeah totally man, that's why I wasn't so worried about the EQ settings you had used, because they're always relative to the rig you have from your guitar down to your cabs and speakers. So the OD1 and OD2 settings where a good base to work off. I'm really impressed with the variety you can get with different pedals infront. That crunch overdrive I was using rather than my usual vintage Overdrive really brought a different texture and voice. The OD boosts a lot of mids, kinda almost like a stuck wha, almost, the crunch didn't have that, it had like texture boost as opposed to a mid rangey style boost. Either way f**king good stuff and yes I shall keep tweaking. That's what this post is all about, my journey using the MP1.
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getting into a good zone using the od on my boss GT5.
Setting that are best for me are actually having the OD drive setting at zero, Bass +16 Trebel 0 Level 45%
Mp1 patch is:
OD1 4.4
OD2 7.0
Bass 0
Mid -1
Trebel 2
Presence 4
This patch works great with the OD boost in front, and also works well if you turn the boost off so this is great for switching from a chuncky thrashier distortion to a smoothier but still responsive distortion which works well for slightly less heavyier requirements, but still heavy enough.
When I add the boost it needs a bit more bottom end so when I turn the OD on the boss I have programmed that the EQ on the boss comes on at the same time and on this I have a +5db LO end boost. I was in the zone with this settings on saturday. Real happy with how it sounds.
On another note, I have bought the Big Noise kit and MDRT of MJMP for this MP1 so I'm hoping for even greater improvement with sound. I'm loving having both tonal variants in the stock MP1 with OD and MP1 3TM. They sound different but both excellent. Perhaps the OD in front of stock MP1 is older school sounding................may be, I like that though :thumb-up:
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Played a gig with the MP1 + boost at the weekend. Sounds f**king excellent but when I turned up really loud I was getting crazy feedback for most of the set. Ok may be not crazy feedback but quite a bit more than normal. Enough to make playing more difficult.
I took the MP1 home and plugged into my recording set up. Same patch, same boost on my boss MFX, what do you know? Sounds f**king amazing here also. No alteration needed on the MP1 or the boss. The exact same settings on both work on my live rig and on my recording rig! How weird is that? Pretty handy if you ask me! The beauty of the boss is I can turn the boost on and off plus turn on the EQ for a tiny bit more bass when the OD boost is applied. Programming them so that they come on and off together is so useful. It means the MP1 patch can be used by itself as it is a nice patch and works without the boost in front. Just if I was needing more of a thrash sound I would need the boost.
I really love the MP1 and I'm glad I kept a stock unit. I might look for another unit, and perhaps have a different mod in it? Who knows. They are stupidly priced these days.