ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear
Non ADA Gear => Guitars => Topic started by: rnolan on January 26, 2016, 06:55:22 AM
-
Hey All, well I've embarked on may latest guitar project, (RG you'll relate to this >:D ), I have a $200 AUD ish Squier strat that I bought for a friends son, deal was if he got keen, buy it from me, long story short, he didn't an now I have it. So it's a Chinese Fender Squier bullet, black with white scratch plate and rosewood FB. So I set it up and used it at rehearsal, mmmm not bad, nice to play but no sustain and PUs are very ordinary (no surprise). I'll temper this with ( I always wanted a black with white SP strat as that's what Blackmore had way back then when I was 13.... so I'm keen...)
Move forward.. It's now got a nice set of Gotoh black chrome MHds, and a Wilkingson trem (lets get some sustain...) and a graphtech nut, and now I'm doing the electronics, SD hot rails for the bridge, SD lil 59 for the neck, switchcaft OP jack, 2 x push pull pots for series/parallel switching of the SDs'.
So now I'm working out the wirering... I want the middle (of 5 poss switch) to be neck and bridge (maybe out of phase, haven't decided), they will each have series/parallel switching from their pots and each have their respective vol control, and either extreme bridge or neck PU. So now the issue is how to work in the middle SC PU so I can combine it with Bridge or Neck.
Of note the 5 way switch is (well new to me) a1 a2 a3 aout / bout b1 b2 b3 (note a1 = b1 but separate out etc) . So my idea (feedback welcome/encouraged BTW) is to have both neck and bridge PUs with individual volume control (series parallel push pull) and wire it such that a1 (bridge PU +) connect to a1 and also b2 and the Neck PU connect to a3 and also b2 then connect both to to a2 (b2 > a2) thus combine the bridge and neck PUs), then connect middle PU (which is stock) to b1 and b3 (which goes to a2) so the in between settings give B + Middle and Middle + neck;; but middle switch selection is b + n
-
what's it look like and how old is it?
I saw weird lookin bullet strats from the late 80's and they didn't have the regular strat shape, they were closer to an SG believe it or not.
I read this and it hurt my head just trying to think about that
[/Of note the 5 way switch is (well new to me) a1 a2 a3 aout / bout b1 b2 b3 (note a1 = b1 but separate out etc) . So my idea (feedback welcome/encouraged BTW) is to have both neck and bridge PUs with individual volume control (series parallel push pull) and wire it such that a1 (bridge PU +) connect to a1 and also b2 and the Neck PU connect to a3 and also b2 then connect both to to a2 (b2 > a2) thus combine the bridge and neck PUs), then connect middle PU (which is stock) to b1 and b3 (which goes to a2) so the in between settings give B + Middle and Middle + neck;; but middle switch selection is b + nquote]
I've never had an individual volume in any of my setups. Most I got for with a 5 way tone control for neck and middle and then a lone tone control for the bridge, sometimes different cap value depends how I feel.
For sustain get a big hunk of brass in there Richard, all adds up. Not sure the fitting of those Chinese bullets but GFS probably have a block that will fit. Far as I know the Korean stuff is the same as the Mexican strats, so probably the same for the Chinese as well.
-
I had a lil' blue version of yours, mine was Indonesian I think. Whatever, the dang thing played very well, but like yours, sounded a bit dead. I replaced the PUs and electronics, but never upgraded the bridge or nut. My mistake, I may have kept it...too late, it's sold ;)
-
Hey RG (http://www.fmicassets.com/Damroot/MedJpg/10002/0310001506_gtr_frt_001_rr.jpg), it's in bits at the moment while I sort the electrics and I'm still waiting for the SD lil 59 to arrive.
Yeah hurt my head thinking it up, spent most of last night until early this morning coming up with that wiring scheme, I kept thinking, just go bog standard, why complicate it... but I want the middle position of the 5 way switch to be bridge + neck. If I ignore the middle PU it's easy but I just had to work out a way to use it (even though it's screwed down as low as possible to be out my way).
I'll post some pics when it's done.
Hey Dante, yeah it plays quite nicely (which is why I'm bothering with it, and I always wanted a black strat with white scratch plate). The bridge it came with is so chinsy so no sustain. The PUs seemed ok but then most things sound ok through the MP2. The hotrails and lil 59 will give it some grunt >:D
-
Of note the 5 way switch is (well new to me) a1 a2 a3 aout / bout b1 b2 b3 (note a1 = b1 but separate out etc) . So my idea (feedback welcome/encouraged BTW) is to have both neck and bridge PUs with individual volume control (series parallel push pull) and wire it such that a1 (bridge PU +) connect to a1 and also b2 and the Neck PU connect to a3 and also b2 then connect both to to a2 (b2 > a2) thus combine the bridge and neck PUs), then connect middle PU (which is stock) to b1 and b3 (which goes to a2) so the in between settings give B + Middle and Middle + neck;; but middle switch selection is b + n
Hey Richard, is this 5 way switch really gonna do what you want it to?
I've attached a diagram that uses a multipole 5 way switch, it allows you to connect your middle pickup to positions 2 and 4.
-
Hey DR, after much mental gymnastics and quite a few pencil diagrams it comes close but not quite :facepalm: , what I came up with requires the B and N +vs to be connected to the same lug (b2) which leaves the 2 PUs connected all the time regardless of switch position. I hadn't considered a "super switch", I didn't know they were available/existed, been a long time since I wired a strat. So thanks heaps for the diagram, I've ordered one (Dimarzio EP1112) as (as in diagram) it does exactly what I want :thumb-up: .
I was trying to get the guitar finished for a Jam on Saturday night but the neck PU hasn't arrived yet :facepalm: oh well, I'll use the Anderson >:D .
The Anderson wiring is my fav, 3 x 3 pos mini toggles, down = series, middle = off, up = parallel for each PU, so you can have any combination, it also has another mini toggle (blower switch) which overrides the others and selects bridge in series. I considered this for the strat but it would look a little dodgy having 3 holes in the switch slot, or it's new scratch plate time...
-
I figured there was some mental gymnastics going on ... just trying to save you a few brain cells :thumb-up:
-
Appreciated :thumb-up: :wave:
-
Update, I got the dimarzio super switch yesterday and now the tusc graphteck nut is in, it's pre slotted so I just need to file the string heights when it finally goes back together. Wilkinson trem is in as is new output jack.
But the little 59 I ordered for the neck still didn't come :facepalm: Distributor is out of stock, so I cancelled the order. I'll ring some other Oz SD dealers to check if any of them has one, otherwise I'll order it online. Amazon won't ship SD to Australia, crap.. but I found one on Reverb.
So I can start to wire it up with the new switch.
Hey DR, I'm going to wire it the same as the diagram you posted except I'll do separate vol for B and N PUs and an overall tone.
-
FYI: I haven't had to file a single Tusq nut string slot, but I have sanded down the bottom of a couple. One (on my goldtop) had to be sanded at an angle, which was fun.
-
This one looks pretty close, I won't have to do much to it ;)
-
Good news on the super switch, they are very useful :thumb-up:
Hope it wasn't too expensive, and please don't send me the bill :facepalm:
Not so good about the neck pickup though ... did you have your heart set on the little 59? Would you consider better quality single coils for the middle and neck positions perhaps?
Aren't Kinman pickups based in Oz land? I haven't tried them yet, but their website is very informative. Really been getting into single coil tones lately (on the quacky 2 and 4 switch positions), I reckon it's my old age kicking in ;)
I've been considering a strat project myself, not sure whether to build one up from scratch or find a donor guitar that I can modify to suit my needs. There's a guy in the UK that does some really nice heavy relic guitars, I've got one of his telecasters that I'm pleased with, he's given me a quote for a similar relic idea with a strat ... I'm thinking about it :dunno:
-
Hey DR, the switch cost $60, so not cheap but will do the job :thumb-up: . I've got a little 59 on it's way from the US. I found a site called reverb.com which acts as a web shop front for sellers and buyers. They also offer some protection etc. The PU shipped from The Music Zoo, interesting store. I ordered it yesterday my time and it's already shipped, so very prompt service :whoohoo!: , not sure how long it will take to get here.
I wasn't aware of Kinman PUs until very recently, and now I've read his bio. He started here, he's set up manufacturing in the Philippines now as cost in Oz are too high :facepalm: . They look very good. Since I settled on the Ultrasonics years ago I haven't kept up with all the comings and goings in guitar and PU land.
It's good to have a project :thumb-up:
-
Lol ... I've been trying to avoid the Music Zoo website (due to temptation), so many nice high-end guitars on there, they were doing a run of carbonized natural finished charvels ... I almost talked myself into pressing the button :facepalm:
-
Hey DR, yeah had me drooling a bit when I checked their site out, some nice guitars over $9k USD :facepalm: , makes me realise what a bargain I got on the JPLP which got reduced from $9k to $7 AUD. Still the most I've ever spent on a guitar. My Anderson was $3.5k but that was 30 years ago so in today's $s was $7.8k.
-
Ok update on this project, it's close to competition now... I had some wiring issues (it's all upside down and it's been a long time since I wired a strat...), and once you've strung it up, getting the PU/scratch plate out (if there are problems) to work on is a major pain... So a few leads got "ripped out" in the coming on frowning... The up side of a FR is it's easy to take off with the strings still attached..
Ok so it's all good now. The Hotrails and the middle PU are in phase, the little 59 in the neck is out of phase. The Bridge Hot rails and the neck L59 both have push/pull jack (series/parallel), the middle PU is as low as I can wind it down. P1 = B, P2 = B + middle (in phase), P3 = B + N (out of phase), P4 = M + N (OOPh) and P5 = N (OOPh). I manged to rip one leg off the 0.022uF cap (vintage wiring) along the way :facepalm: , so I got 2 x 0.0068 caps from a Behringer compressor I've been disassembling so combined them in parallel to give me 0.0136 uF on the overall tone pot (not bad BTW). So it's all up and working, I'm still tinkering with the setup but it's going in a good direction.
-
woh ! you killed your behringer compressor to get the caps ???
Are you familiar with this 5 way switch setup ??
-
Hey Tomy, The compressor was stuffed already (a mate gave me a bunch of old PA bits he didn't want), I've been using it (and other bits) to practice de-soldering. Getting the strat scratch plate out from under the strings to work on caused a few issues (one of which ripped a leg of the 0.022uF tone cap :facepalm: ). So I went looking for some caps that were close in the gear I'd been pulling apart (as opposed to going to the electronics store today (which it now is) and buying some new caps) (this was 3am stuffing around and I wanted to get it working). So after researching WTF the funny numbers on caps meant and also some ideas regarding what values to use I went looking for some caps that might work in the stuff I've been practicing on. So I found 2 caps (2A682Js) which combined in parallel give me 0.01364uF and I'd read about smaller capacitance, less dark, less treble loss, so gave it a go (which I quite like BTW). Anyway I really just wanted to get the strat going (which it now is :whoohoo!: ).
I'm now quite familiar with the Dimazio 5 way super switch, I tried to achieve the same thing with the 5 way switch it had but hit a dead end (and my head was hurting LoL). The super switch is actually quite easy to understand, it has 4 sets of the 5 positions, each with their own output (I only use 3), so made the wiring I wanted quite easy. So it's B, B + M, B + N, M + N, N and both B and N have their own push pull vol pots (series/parallel) and then one overall tone (50's wiring style)). Also the N is out of phase with both M and B PUs
-
I should add some comments about where it's got to. The Hot rails in the bridge is great (not particularly like a strat PU but that's not what I care about). The little 59 is also very nice in the neck. The combo of different switch positions I'm yet to explore fully but I'm getting some interesting tones (clean and dirty), I need to run up some patches in the MP2 specifically for this guitar (al Dante LoL). I really like the Wilkinson trem, $40 well spent and now I have sustain. The graphteck nut is good, not sticky and required no filing (as Dante also attested to...). I really like the black chrome gotohs, they look great and, like all gotohs stay in tune :whoohoo!: I'm still making very subtle adjustments to the set up, but it's close now. Now I need to crank it >:D and get it howling.
-
Mmm don't believe a word,we want some soundclips ;D
-
Fair call my friend, since my protools pc died I've been at a loss for recording. But I did download reaper to try which I assume will work with my laptops I/O so I will whip something up soon :thumb-up:
-
Ok great!
-
Well after tonight when Mike pulled a fantastic variety of sounds from it with his MP1 rig (it's also awesome with my MP2 BTW), we need to do some audio for you.. stayed tuned we'll get to it.
-
Aha so your admitting that the mp-1 actually sounds better then the mp-2 ;D
-
Aha, would this be the same mp-1 that Richard used to own? :wave:
-
I'm now quite familiar with the Dimazio 5 way super switch, I tried to achieve the same thing with the 5 way switch it had but hit a dead end (and my head was hurting LoL). The super switch is actually quite easy to understand, it has 4 sets of the 5 positions, each with their own output (I only use 3), so made the wiring I wanted quite easy. So it's B, B + M, B + N, M + N, N and both B and N have their own push pull vol pots (series/parallel) and then one overall tone (50's wiring style)). Also the N is out of phase with both M and B PUs
So you never use the bridge PU alone, wich is not a bad idea !
-
Hey MJMP, the MP1 (and yes DR it's my first MP1 that's now Mike's :facepalm: I had to sell it to buy the MP2, which I don't really regret well maybe a bit..). But crap the MP1 was singing with the strat with one of mikes lead patches.. He took it through all the possible combinations, worked a treat, but through MP2 mmmmm, even better. Hey, I like all the sounds.... It's good it works so well with both. My take is I'd like a MP1 and MP2 in the same box..... they are both so good. Is one better than the other, no, they are very different beasts...
But lets get real, if you feed a good guitar into MP1 or MP2 it's going to sound (f$%$%ng) goooood. :thumb-up:
Bridge PU, I used to use it almost exclusively, but these days I tend to use the neck PU (big change for me BTW), I just prefer the tone and dynamics, but I'm also going more simple of late.... also adjusting things at the guitar (if I can)
-
Hey R,i was just joking,remember i use both. :bow:
-
Oops ... and I was joking on top of the first joke, sorry :bow:
-
woh ! you killed your behringer compressor to get the caps ???
This will go over in history, no less!
Ripping cheap Chinese caps off a Behringer is purebred desperados extremos, even for me. I salute you! :bow:
Cool axe upgrade project, BTW
-
Sorry if my response seemed a bit too serious, I got the jokes :thumb-up: and was chuckling as I typed :wave: . The caps were purely opportunistic, it was midnight, I'd wrecked the 0.022uF cap :facepalm: , so I went looking on the 2 old compressors I'd been pulling apart to practice desoldering, then had to research what the writing on the caps means... found 2 that were ballpark (2A682J), and went from there. I already knew I wanted lower value = more subtle tone roll and it's worked out well :whoohoo!:
Mike asked me last night how much it had cost so I did the maths:
Squire Bullet strat ~$200, PUs (Hot Rails and Little59) ~$130 each, Wilkinson Trem $40 (great value BTW), graphtec nut $15, switchcraft jack $10, blackgrome gotohs $60, 2 dimarzio push pull pots $50, dimarzio super switch $60 so all up ~$595 then add labor (fun) ?? So quite a decent guitar for $600 ish, add hard case $700
It's one way to go and these style projects are much easier these days, 40 years ago nothing fitted coz copywrite laws and mms vs inches etc, so much is licensed now that things "tend" to fit (eg the nut was a straight swap, no filing required (as Dante said about the graphtecs)).
-
Hey Richard, sounds like you are really happy with graphite nut : wich model is it ?
-
Anyway, I' ve heard so many People talking baddly about wilkinson trem. I know it doesn't have the same performances than a FR, but it's still Ok to me !
-
Hey Tomy, the graphtec nut was their standard (black) replacement for a strat (can't remember the model/no). They do one that is curved on the bottom but has a block in the centre so you can remove (file) the centre block for a curved nut installation (ie US and Mexican strats) or not for Squire etc which has a flat nut slot. Obviously you have to get one with the right string spacing/width. So it's made of tusc and seems pretty good so far. I was pretty impressed that it just needed the old nut tapped out, dob of super glue and in it went. I thought I'd need to file the string slots but it's just fine... $15 well spent :thumb-up:
Of all the bits I bought for this project the Wilkinson trem is not only great value ($40) but an excellent bridge. I wouldn't compare it to a FR as it's not a locking bridge setup, just a straight strat replacement. It has a nice really solid steel sustain block, stainless steel everything else (including saddles). And the screw holes are overloid/widened so it fits easily for a variety of guitars. Trem action is good, the bar doesn't screw in, but has a small grub screw to tighten it so it doesn't fall out. I have it set to come back flush with the top, this will allow easy dropped D. If I float it I'd consider a HipShot tremsetter (which I have on both FRs (Anderson and Tele). But so far it's going well and I would definitely recommend them as a high qual replacement bridge. Very well made, adds lots of sustain, fitted easily, nice and shiny LoL
-
Ok would I change anything from where it's got to ? There's some aesthetic changes that Mike suggested as currently the super switch has a black knob and the trem, vol and tone knobs are white, maybe they should all be black, would look better although easiest right now is make the s-switch knob white (it came with the alternative).
From a playing perspective, push push pots would be better (or 3 x 3 pos switches but then I'd need a blank scratch plate or it will look a bit dodgy). Next change of strings I'll move the neck vol pot to the lower tone position and bring the tone knob to the middle of the 3, just easier to get at and pull up when desired (push push pots would fix this problem better...). At some stage I may look at floating the trem, currently I have returning to flush (which will allow dropped D if desired), then I'd need to add a Hipshot tremestter..
Other than that, this is all a good idea for anyone with a Squire strat (that their kid they bought it for didn't get into... which is where it started for me LoL). But pick your squire carefully, they do vary, pick one that plays well :thumb-up: , the hardware will suck, but you can change that...