ADA Depot - A Forum To Support Users of ADA Amplification Gear

ADA Preamps => MP-2 => Topic started by: MRob on November 17, 2016, 10:01:28 AM

Title: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on November 17, 2016, 10:01:28 AM
Hi all I'm glad this forum is back up and running.    I'm brand new to rack stuff, have always used heads and combos.

About 2 yrs ago I bought an ADA MP2, MosValve Power Amp and a ProVerb FX unit.  Received it, left it in the box and NEVER messed with it!  I recently got a steal on a Rocktron Hush (newer version) so I have that now and I also have a Furman Power Conditioner.  I have a Mesa Ported 1x12 cab, a Genz Benz Gflex 2x12, a Carvin 4x12 and a few others, so I have cabs.  Wow... So, now it's time to build this thing and see what I can get out of it!

Any suggestions to start with?

What kind of cables should I use to hook it all up?  HOW do I hook all this stuff up???  Should I get a shallow rack or a regular 19" rack.  6RU or 8RU?

Looking for your expertise advice.   I know there may be better units to buy with what I have here, but I've never even hooked this up, so I want to try this to start with. 

I'm an 80's guy and am dying to get something near the good old 80's rock sound..

Looking forward to your thoughts and advice!

Thanks!
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: vansinn on November 17, 2016, 10:28:49 AM
Not really much to say other than go get a 19" box and start loading it with what you have now.
If one of your devices are a Bit shallow, perhaps the Furman can be rear mounted, resulting in a mere 4u box.
I see a nice rig coming out of it; not'n to be ashamed about..

You may have an issue with not having identical cabs for each side, but no one says stereo cannot be stacked vertically.
You might want to try stacking the 2x12 on top of the 4x12 and run this as 'vertical stereo'; will still give you a nice ambient sound scape.

Oh, and welcome in here - I seem to forget this these days ;)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 17, 2016, 12:45:30 PM
Maybe go for an 8 RU rack case, I know from experience you get more stuff in the future  ::) I also started out with a 4 RU and I have an 18 RU now. Also the MP-2 gets quite hot after a few hours of use so it would be best to leave one space open above so it gets some cool air.
I would not go for a shallow rack, might be too small for the MP-2.And I don't know how deep that mosvalve is. Maybe others can give some advise here.

As for connections, you will need some patch cables too hook it all up. And you can either use the loop of the MP-2 to put the effects in or you can connect them after the MP-2.Never used the stereo loop of the MP-2 so don't know if it's good or not.

Then some midi? Do you have a midi foot controller ? In can see something that looks like a ADA midi controller in the pic, correct? If so which model is it? The ART has midi, does the hush also have midi (some models do ,some don't)

So let us know and I'm sure others will chime in too, so you'll have that rack up and running soon.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Kim on November 17, 2016, 03:51:14 PM
Hi and Welcome!  :wave:

I have my fx unit in the MP-2 Loop, no problems there that I'm aware of as long as you aren't driving that Loop too hard...as always, pay mind to the Gain Structures when combining rack units and set the levels appropriately.

You might find that your Hush unit isn't really needed as well.  The MP-2 has a pretty good Noise Reduction/Gate, just takes a little tweaking to set to your liking but then you can also have it set differently for every patch you program/use.

Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on November 17, 2016, 04:47:50 PM
Welcome to the Depot MRob!

   A standard size rack would be a good idea since I know the Furman and ADA's are the same depth. You always want to have room for your connections in the back without bending your connections at the jacks. I'm not sure how deep the power amp is though, so you may want to take that into consideration. Also, if the power amp is a tube amp, leaving a space between units is a good idea, or else you can use a small clip on fan in back of the rack to move air around your tube equipment. That will help prevent problems caused by heat.
   When you mount your gear in the rack case, as you are looking at the rack from the back, run all your power cables on the left side, and all your audio cables on the right. Send your control cables, (Midi, foot switches) up the center. As for audio cables, try to use only the length you need for your connections. If your soldering skills are good, you can make your own cables to length, and all audio cables are shielded, speaker cables are NEVER shielded. You always want to make cables that have enough length to plug in without stressing, (no sharp bends at the jacks), and I prefer Switchcraft jacks.
   I never used the ART unit, but it looks like the standard DSP processor of the day, so it will be fine in the effects loop of the MP-2, especially if you are going to use time based effects like delay and reverb. The MP-2 loops have a mix control for each loop, but I've found that if I leave the mix at 100% wet in the MP-2, and adjust the effects level on the unit to a lower, more useable mix, that the MP-2 tone is more satisfying to my ears. Of course with certain effects processors, the opposite is true. You'll have to use your ears for that.
   The MP-2 is a very complicated unit in terms of programming and editing, just don't give up on it. There is plenty of help here at the Depot, and we'll get you going with it. If you are going to use the Hush unit instead of the built-in noise gate, I would recommend putting that in the signal chain between the output of the preamp and the input of the power amp instead of in the effects loop. You may want to get all your connections together and hook up everything on your desktop and audition it that way before mounting everything in the rack. That way, you'll know how everything will be connected and how it will sound when it's all in the case.
   If you are going to run a stereo rig, and your 4x12 cab has the ability to run in stereo, then that would be the ideal way to audition your rack rig. Just be sure the impedance of the power amp and the cab are matched. You never want the speaker impedance to be lower than the power amp impedance or you'll cook the power amp.

    That should get you started.

     Harley 8)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on November 17, 2016, 07:46:03 PM
Wow!  Thank you to everyone here!  You guys are great!! 

A lot of info here, looks like I have a lot more to think about than I had expected.  I'm off all next week, so will get started with things and keep you all posted here.

I greatly appreciate the time and dedication you all put into helping us newbies!   :headbanger:
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 18, 2016, 04:44:48 AM
The hush does need to be put before any time based effects like a delay and reverb, else the tail of the delay or reverb could be cut off to early when it goes below the threshold of the hush.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on November 18, 2016, 04:59:12 AM
Wow!  Thank you to everyone here!  You guys are great!! 

A lot of info here, looks like I have a lot more to think about than I had expected.  I'm off all next week, so will get started with things and keep you all posted here.

I greatly appreciate the time and dedication you all put into helping us newbies!   :headbanger:

   That's why we're here :thumb-up:

   *MJMP is absolutely correct about the Hush unit, but you may find you don't really need it, (until you get bitten by the bug and get a MP-1).
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 18, 2016, 11:00:48 AM
Hey MRob, welcome to the depot, some good advice already coming your way I see  :thumb-up: .  And you have the makings of one of the best analogue guitar racks available on the planet IMHO.
I'll be a little more opinionated (as your rack will be very similar to mine), forget the hush, sell it you don't need it, the MP2 noise gate will work just fine for really high gain settings, for middle to lower gain (MP2 voices 6 or less) you don't need a gate (or your gain structure is not good).  Run the FX in the MP2 stereo loop as this will let you use the cab sim outputs for recording and still have FXs on it (should you want to).  You need minimum 4 RU rack but as MJMP says good to have more space to add to (he's got 18RU  :facepalm: ).  My rack is 8RU but I have a small mixer velcroed to the bottom of it.  6 RU is a good in between and will still fit in your car boot, 8RU fits in some boots but not all (a bit of practicality).  Mount the MP2 at the top of the rack, this gives it a bit of "breathing space" between top of the rack and MP2, they do get hot, ideally leaving a 1/2 to 1 RU gap is a good idea for cooling but not essential, I've run my MP2 like this for years with no problem (and I'm in Australia, not known for being a cold place LoL).  Unless you have power issues in your area or where you intend to use this rig you also don't need the furman, I've never needed one or similar unless I play off a generator (which are sometimes dodgy) and then a $200 computer UPS works better and is heaps cheaper (others here may disagree but this is my extended experience with MP2 rigs) and the only time you'd really need power conditioning.  If you do want to use the furman, mount it at the bottom so your MP2 is the top unit and can breathe. Put you FX under the MP2 (as doesn't get as hot) followed by poweramp.  Connect cabs in stereo (like already suggested), ADA rigs just melt you when in stereo, even if the cabs aren't perfectly the same (obviously make sure the speaker power ratings (watts) and impedance (ohms) matches the power amp.

The main commercially available racks (SKB, Gator etc) seem to come in 3 depths, shallow, in-between and deep.  The in-between racks suit ADA rigs the best as the ADA units are 10.5 inches deep (e.g. SKB ATA rack, these are the older style SKB racks and are harder to find but they are perfect).  The shallow racks can work (e.g. SKB Roto rack) but you'll need to have right angled jack patch leads and there's less room for MP2 to cool/breathe.  The deep racks are a bit too deep but have more room for a powerboard etc (or as suggested to mount the furman from the back). Though I'd suggest sell the hush and the furman and use the $s to buy the rack.
From the little bit in the corner of your pic (as MJMP noted) it seems you have the ADA MXC midi pedal ?? If you got the standard MP2 pedal pack it should also have a 7 pin midi lead, 1 x expression pedal, a quad switch and a wall wart to phantom power the pedal via the back of the MP2.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on November 18, 2016, 09:08:28 PM
Wow! You guys are GREAT!  Thanks so much once again. 

Ok, so I have the units together now, but not hooked up.  I have "some clue" where to start from reading here, but looking at the back I have no clue how to get these all hooked up! 

I am posting another pic or two so you can better see the rig in full.  And yes, as some have mentioned, I have these two foot switches... Not sure what the small one is for, but they are in the pics below.

I just got the Hush... it's a newer model and I picked it up for $49.00!  I'm sure I could sell it as mentioned, but I would like to hook it up in my system and see what it does or doesn't do for me.  If not needed, I will sell it.

Also, I was just planning on running this through my 1x12 ported Mesa cab for simplicity.   It sounds like most recommend using two cabs and running stereo?   Will the 1x12 alone not sound good?
IF I do use two cabs should they be set apart from each other?   (I've never ran anything stereo before)

IF stereo is that much better then I will consider getting another Mesa 1x12 cab to match.

I've been chasing the 80s sound for a long time and have had many amps to include a Mark V that I sold!  (sellers regret)  BUT it was a pain to tweak and was also noisy and I just couldn't get what I wanted with it.   When I hear the MP2 on youtube I "hear it!"  I hear the sound that I've been looking for!  And that's on freakin Youtube!  I'm sure it's gonna sound great!
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 19, 2016, 03:57:39 AM
I attached a pic with the connections.

I would put the mosvalve below in the case, then the ART,Hush and on top the MP-2.

Not on the pic are the connections to the speaker(s) ,but that speaks for it self. I would go stereo since the whole rig is stereo.

Also not on the pic is the midi pedal, seems you have an MXC with the quad switch and pedal. Hook the pedal and quad switch to the MXC (use stereo leads !).You can find all info in the MXC manual.Then use a 7 pin midi cable and go from the MXC midi out to the MP-2 midi in.The only thing left to do is hook up the wall adapter of the pedal to the phantom power in plug on the back of the MP-2 (next to the midi in jack).This way the power for the pedal goes through the midi cable.

Next is to do the programming, but first hook it up.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 20, 2016, 03:21:16 AM
Hey MRob, There are a few ways you can plug it together.  What MJMP has posted uses the Hush in the FX loop, I wouldn't put it there as it a noise gate thing (but he obviously has reasons for this thinking).  I've not used a Hush and maintain it is  totally superfluous to your needs.  However, if you insist on bothering with it, I'd put it between the MP2 A/B out puts and the poweramp (MP2 A/B out > Hush L/R inputs, Hush L/R out puts > power amp chn1/2 inputs).  (However, I suggest you start without using the Hush and include it later if you want to).  So then MP2 FX send 1/2 to FX unit L/R inputs, FX L/R output to MP2 FX 1/2 returns.  To hear the FXs you will need to turn on the FX loop for each patch (that you want FX for) and adjust the wet/dry mix on the MP 2 patch loop (default is 25%  (ie 75% dry sound, 25% wet sound) and a good place to start) and adjust the FX units wet/dry mix to be Full Wet. Also set MP2 FX loop buttons to line level. If you haven't read the MP2 manual, please read it now, it will help you understand how it works and also make better sense of our suggestions and then, make your own choices (for now don't worry about the real time midi stuff). Then read the MXC pedal manual.  Initially you can leave the expression pedal and Quad switch alone (they use real time midi continuous control) and work them in later when you understand  how they work and what they do.

For Cabs, you can use your 1 x 12 Messa on one poweramp output (channel) and use your 2 x12 cab on the other (this is easiest for now I suspect (or use 2 x12 and 4 x12)).  But better would probably be use your Carvin 4 x 12 cab but rewire it to run stereo  as then each channel has the same speakers (now some 4 x 12 cabs have stereo mono wiring built in already). If yours does (BTW which carvin 4 x 12 is it ?  they make quite a few different cabs) then just select the stereo option and plug 2 speaker leads into it Poweramp out 1/2 > cab L/R in.
Ideally the distance/gap between cabs (if you use 2 cabs) is at least the width of the widest cab (usually the same width as you would generally use 2 identical cabs).  With 4 x 12 cabs wired stereo, you get some modulation inside the cab but lets go there later...
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Rawk777 on November 20, 2016, 07:35:21 AM
I think MarshallJMP diagram makes a lot of sense, and is the right way to do it, but requires a strong unerstanding on how to program everything.

If you want a shortcut to test your rig without having to program everything, you could skip the effect loop and midi link between mp2 and art to make it simpler to use.

MP2 stage output > Hush > Art > MosValve

Once you can use this simpler setup and have some fun with it, you could then try using it like MarshallJMP suggest it.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 20, 2016, 09:36:53 AM
MP2 stage output > Hush > Art > MosValve



That would be the way I would do it personnaly
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Kim on November 20, 2016, 09:55:28 AM
MP2 stage output > Hush > Art > MosValve



That would be the way I would do it personnaly

 ^  Except for the Hush.  I've always had my rack hooked up in series like this, but I changed it about a year ago.  Now I have my fx in the Loop in order to take advantage of using the MP-2 XLR Recording Outs should I ever need to for any reason.   If the units are in Series, then any external fx would not be present at the Recording Outs. 

No Hush needed with the MP-2.  (MP-1 based racks will need one, but in Series....never in Loop.)

That said, I recommend to anyone new to racks to hook it up in series; the easiest way first.  Then, after becoming familiar with everything they can decide if a change needs to be made.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: vansinn on November 20, 2016, 10:07:28 AM
Ahh, the love and joy of programmable systems ;)

Should something not work as intended, despairth noth my friend, but listen to network people:
"In case it doesn't work, check the PSU, then the wiring, then the routing.
If it still doesn't work, check the routing again, just in case.."
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 20, 2016, 09:07:04 PM
All good advice guys  :thumb-up: but why would you put the hush in the MP2 (parallel) loop ?? it's just going to either gate the Fx (if placed last in the loop) or gate the Fx send into the Fx (which will be mixed back with the dry signal at 25%) if it's the first in the loop you put it there  :dunno: . Also the MP2 has a noise gate per patch which you only need on the very high gain voices (7, 8, 9 and 10).  Seems more sensible to put the Fx in the loop (so Fx on recording outs as well as main outs and better gain structure and analogue tone preservation) and put the hush between the MP2 main outs and poweramp.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Kim on November 21, 2016, 02:49:35 AM
All good advice guys  :thumb-up: but why would you put the hush in the MP2 (parallel) loop ?? it's just going to either gate the Fx (if placed last in the loop) or gate the Fx send into the Fx (which will be mixed back with the dry signal at 25%) if it's the first in the loop you put it there  :dunno: . Also the MP2 has a noise gate per patch which you only need on the very high gain voices (7, 8, 9 and 10).  Seems more sensible to put the Fx in the loop (so Fx on recording outs as well as main outs and better gain structure and analogue tone preservation) and put the hush between the MP2 main outs and poweramp.

Arg. :facepalm:  I didn't proofread my Quote very well I guess, and have fixed that. 
For the record:  I don't and would NOT use a separate Hush unit at all with the MP-2.   :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 21, 2016, 03:16:59 AM
Hey Kim, as posted, nor would I use a Hush in this context but MRob has one and wants to include it.  So where best to include it for him ?  Now MJMP has suggested 1st in Fx loop before muti FX (Art was it ?). Now this makes sense (to me) more with 3TM serial mono (not stereo parallel) Fx loop, hence I'm wondering about MJMPs reasons for the choice  :dunno: . And also maybe use the 2 Hush channels separately (gate before the 3TM (chan A) and in the loop (chan B)) (which IIRC is similar to how MJMP uses his ?). But this is for a 3TM MP1.  Hey MRob hope we're not spinning you out too much here  :facepalm: .  The most simple stereo (which WILL sound allot better than mono) set up to start with is probably:
MP2 main out A/B > Art Fx in L/R, Art Fx out L/R > Mosvalve L/R in, Mosvalve speaker out > cabs.  And you will need to adjust the dry guitar to FX mix in the Art Fx to taste (how much Fx you want to hear).
If you wanted to then add the Hush, I'd put it after the Art Fx before the Mosvalve. (so MP2 > Art > Hush > Mosvalve > cabs). As you can probably tell by now, there are many ways to plug things together, and reasons why you would maybe go one way or another...
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Rawk777 on November 21, 2016, 04:36:11 AM
In general, you want a noise gate before delay and reverb fx type.
You can use it after other fx types (chorus, phaser, etc), but before reverb and delay.

Let me explain : the noise gate will cut the signal when it reaches a certain level. If you use a long reverb, for exemple, the tail of the reverb will be cut by the noise gate, which is not what you want.

It's true that it doesn't make any sense to put the hush in a parallel fx loop. Can the mp2 fx loop can be used serial?
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on November 21, 2016, 05:56:37 AM
All good advice guys  :thumb-up: but why would you put the hush in the MP2 (parallel) loop ?? it's just going to either gate the Fx (if placed last in the loop) or gate the Fx send into the Fx (which will be mixed back with the dry signal at 25%) if it's the first in the loop you put it there  :dunno: . Also the MP2 has a noise gate per patch which you only need on the very high gain voices (7, 8, 9 and 10).  Seems more sensible to put the Fx in the loop (so Fx on recording outs as well as main outs and better gain structure and analogue tone preservation) and put the hush between the MP2 main outs and poweramp.

   Putting the Hush between the main outs and the power amp will gate the delays and reverbs. Put it in the loop before the ART and the only thing that will be gated is the noise on the high gain programs.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: vansinn on November 21, 2016, 08:33:50 AM
Just a notice about to stereo or not - or to pseudo-stereo..
If you don't really feel the need for stereo, you could rewire a 4x12 for dual-mono; that is, two speakers to left channel, the other two for right.
While this is essentially still stereo, it won't feel like a spread-out stereoscopic field, but will still result in a nice ambient sound field.

If your speakers are 8 Ohm each, you can wire two in series for a 16 Ohm resulting load on you amp, which will never burn the output transformer - but you might loose some watts if the amp has less than 16 Ohm out.
If your amp has, say, 4 Ohm output, you can wire the two speakers in parallel for a resulting 4 Ohm load to the amp, and you won't loose power.

(I don't have any of the above setups, but once had a Roland Jazz Chorus 2x12 stereo combo; same thing, and nice compact ambient sound)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 21, 2016, 09:36:44 AM
It's a fact that if you put the hush in the loop you will need to set the loop to serial (100% wet)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: vansinn on November 21, 2016, 11:41:44 AM
My question is this:
If you put a hush in a loop and dry/wet mix it, will this better allow playing the old Deep Purple song Hush-Hush.. :dunno: :crazy: :lol:
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on November 21, 2016, 09:01:34 PM
Wowwww!  This is some intense stuff!  You guys are amazing to say the least. Thank you all so much for your time and efforts here.  It looks like my requests have sparked quite a conversation.

Ok, so please allow me re-vamp my request a bit and provide more info. 

1.  This is the first rack I have EVER messed with or ever used.  I have never even played through a rack system let alone hook one up in any way. 
2.  Stereo?  I have heard that it sounds amazing.  I've never played "stereo" - that I know of anyway.  I've always just played through amps and cabs driven by heads or a combo amp.
3.  My effects have always been on my pedal board - Modulation pedals, an over drive, EQ, TU-2(tuner), CryBaby, ISP Decimater.
4.  I detest that "noise" during high gain... it's extremely annoying to me especially when playing live.  The Decimater would do "ok", but when I read all the reviews on the Hush and read that many pros still use them today, I searched and picked one up.
If the Hush is truly not needed here, then we can leave it out of the mix until I "graduate" to an MP-1 :).
5.  Despite all my years of playing I have also never ran anything through an effects loop, so that's new to me as well.
6.  I have NO idea whatsoever, what "dry" and "wet" means.  I've heard other players talk about it in the studio and all... probably the same conversation of how they are going to approach the diminished 3rd on the 9th octave of the flat 5!  Again, NO CLUE!  LOL!  :headbanger:
7.  I won't be doing any recording in the near to long future, so "recording" is a non issue for now.

I haven't hooked anything up at this point as I'm still trying to understand it all AND waiting on longer patch cables to get it all together.

So... having said all of that... let's re-vamp things.

NO Hush in the mix
Using just the 1 - 1x12 ported Mesa Cab
Simple, yet effective set up

I would be using this set up to rehearse with and also play live with.  I will mic the cab, nothing direct and no need to record anything.

I will be reading the manuals as suggested until I get the cables to hook it all up.

Do I need TS or TRS cables?   I have already learned that I need about 18" cables! :)   Regular colored patch cables work ok?

What I'm looking for is that 80's Big Rock sound... i.e., Nuno, Skid Row, Great White -  Volbeat has that sound today!  It sounds SO good to me.  Not that "thin" over-processed sound that some bands had.  It was a big guitar sound.  Again, Skid Row really nails this sound.  From what i've read the MP1 was used on these albums back then.

So... I know I've given a lot more info here.  I greatly appreciate all of your awesome help.  Wow!  This is all good stuff!



Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 22, 2016, 01:41:23 AM
Hey MRob, hang in there  :wave: , we'll help you decipher it all LoL. I now understand MJMPs initial suggestion re hush placement.  How you plug things together depends on lots of things.  The additional info you posted helps us focus on your needs, thanks for that.
Ok.  Wet/Dry, this is important to understand and not particularly complicated.
The "dry" signal is generally considered to be the guitar signal after being preamped by the tubes (so distortion and eq added).  The signal coming from your PUs (BTW I'm ignoring any stomp pedals here) is in millivolts.  This signal is "preamplified" by the MP2 tubes and boosted to around a volt.  Depending how you set the tube drive levels and MP2 voices, the tone is altered and various amounts of tube distortion added. The signal then passes through the MP2 eq stages (it has 2 different eqs ie your standard bass, mid, treb, presence boost or cut and then a 9 band graphic eq for finer more selective boost or cut at the various frequencies involved in a guitar signal).  What comes out of this is called the dry signal (ie no Fx added yet).  There is a really good block diagram at the front (page 2 IIRC) of the MP2 manual which shows the signal flow through the MP2.  As you learn and understand more you'll get a handle on what each stage of the MP2 does/can do to the signal (and thus why the various reasons/suggestions in these posts).
The "wet" signal generally refers to FX like delay, reverb, chorus. eg a fully wet signal will sound like a bathtub of delay and reverb etc.
Normally you want to hear the dry signal with some Fx added in, how much Fx you add in depends on the sound you want.  So you could add in a little delay and reverb etc just to augment the sound a bit, or you could add allot of Fx signal to the point where you can't hear the dry signal any more (full wet).  This is the wet/dry mix ie how much dry signal compared to how much wet signal.  So dry is no Fx and wet is all Fx.  The dry signal coming from the eq and then noise gate is split into stereo by the MP2 chorus stage, these are then further split into dry/wet by the MP2 Fx loop.  Generally you plug the Fx sends into the L/R inputs of Fx devices (you have an Art multi fx unit) where you apply delay, reverb etc.  The Fx unit L/R outputs then plug into the MP2 Fx returns (hence a loop if you will). The MP2 has a Mix setting to control how much of the "wet" fx signal is combined back in with the dry signal (split off earlier just before the loop).  How much Fx is combined is controlled by the Mix setting.  By default the MP2 mix is set to 25% for each return (they don' have to be set the same but is simpler) as this works fine as a starting point.  Now within the Fx unit itself, it will also have a wet/dry mix setting.  When using it in the MP2 Fx loop, it's best IMO to set this to full wet (all Fx and no dry) and do the balance/mix between wet and dry signals with the MP2 mix settings.
However, you could put the Art Fx after the MP2 (ie MP2 out A/B > Art > amp > cabs) in which case you would need to use the Art Fx wet/dry mix settings to get the balance between wet and dry you want.
Now as you look at the MP2 signal flow diagram you'll see there is a compressor and wah filter before the tube section (lets discuss them later) and then the tone(basic eq) and graphic eq sections feed the Mp2 noise gate (does the same thing as the hush basically, gets rid of the additional noise created by really high gain tube settings) and then onto the MP2 chorus (this is where the MP2 goes "pseudo" stereo).  You can do chorus with the MP2 or in the Art Fx (or both  :facepalm: ).  The MP2 Fx loop is after the chorus and is now L and R, hence Fx send 1 and 2. Here you can add delay, reverb, phase, flange etc with a Fx unit(s) and mix them into the (now stereo) signal.  So an FX loop is a way to combine (typically higher quality) Fx into you signal (rather than putting them up front via various stop boxes).  The rack Fx unit(s) can be programmed and controlled by Midi switching, so not only are they much better quality sounds, you don't need lots of pedals and wall warts etc at your feet. So you can call up a particular MP2 patch with your MXC pedal (eg 100) and the Fx unit will change also to patch 100 (often 99, but another conversation) and what you have programmed for that Fx patch is also recalled and applied. So no more doing the pedal dance to turn Fxs on off etc.

To get you started, I suggest you go Guit > MP2 (Art Fx in MP2 Fx loop Fx send 1/2 to Art in L/R, Art out L/R to MP2 Fx returns 1/2) > amp > cabs (use both your Messa 1 x 12 and the 2 x 12, one on each amp channel, it will sound much better than just 1 x12 but try both (ie just 1 x12 or 1 x12 and 2 x 12) a see (hear) what you think).  Your MXC pedal needs power, it usually gets it by using the 7 pin midi lead (MXC midi out to MP2 midi in) and the wall wart plugs into the back of the MP2 (just next to the midi in socket). You then use the MXC to change the MP2 patches. You also plug a midi cable between the MP2 midi out (or midi through) into the Art Fx midi in, this feeds the midi program change from the MXC pedal to the Art at the same time as to the MP2. To make life simple, set the MP2 midi channel and the Art Fx midi channel to receive "All" or Omni.

When you use the MP2 Fx loop, it can be switched on or off for "each" patch, edit the desired patch that you want Fx on and turn the loop on, it will default to 25% wet/dry mix setting which should work fine and in the Art, adjust for full wet mix (no dry).

Cables, the cheap colored patch cables are ok but they are not normally soldered inside the plugs and can be problematic, that said if you are not changing them much they work ok.  Better to use good quality leads (I make my own mostly).

One more comment re wet dry...  You could (pedantically) argue that any change to the raw guitar signal is adding "wet" (eg adding distortion or eq etc).  In all this discussion it really would only be the MP2 chorus (and maybe wah) that you would "normally" consider as additional wet.  The distortion and eq (or even compressor and noise gate) would be considered part of the "dry" sound.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 22, 2016, 06:06:17 AM
Also you asked about TRS or TS jacks, all the MP2 jack connections are TS (unbalanced) 1/4" jacks.  The Art Fx and the Amp are also unbalanced TS as far as I know so standard shielded jack leads will be fine.

To plug in your ART Fx. use 4 short patch leads, MP2 Fx 1/2 out to Art L/R inputs, Art L/R outputs to MP2 Fx returns 1/2.  Set the MP2 Fx buttons to line level and adjust the Art mix slider to the right (full wet), and make sure the Fx loop is turned on in the MP2 patch you are using or you wont get any Fxs.  The MP2 Fx loop is on or off per patch. (later you can use the quad switch to turn it on/off while playing if you want (another conversation).
And with your Mossvalve, 2 short patch leads, MP2 main out A/B to Mossvale in 1 and 2, and 2 "speaker" leads for the outputs 1 and 2 to the cabs (don't use guitar patch leads here!).  Try the gain knobs about half to start with and MP2 vol knob and room eq knob about 12 o'clock as well.  Start with the presence off on the Mossvalve then try turning it up to hear what it does.  Presence is a hi-mid freq boost around the area our ears are most sensitive.  depends on the unit/implementation but it's usually around 4, 5 or 6 khz, you can think of it as "cut" as it will make the sound cut through the mix. E.g. shure SM 58s and 57s have a presence hump (boost) around 5khz to help a vocal cut through (stand out).
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on November 22, 2016, 09:31:02 AM
Hi MRob

    The 80's was all about big guitar sounds. One of the way you can do this is with a stereo rig. Stereo does sound wider which give you a larger sense of size whereas mono sounds more "in-your-face."
   As Richard stated above, when you use the built in Chorus effects in the MP-2, (which is a very lush effect), the MP-2 will already put your rig in stereo with a slight time and pitch modulation between channels. The Chorus is adjustable in the sub menus, so you can make it go from subtle to extreme to suit your taste.
   The MP-2 also has a built in wah effect which can be set to a triggered mode,( it activates when you hit the strings), or remote, (can be controlled with the CCP/MXC pedal), so it's just like a stand alone wah.
   *NOTE* you will need T/R/S leads to connect the Quad switch and CCP to the MXC pedal.

    I would recommend good quality cables to connect your guitar system together, something that doesn't contribute to signal loss. You could have the best sounding guitar and amplifier in the world, but if the cables that connect it all together are weak, you will lose a lot of the good things you are looking to get out of it. It's your call.

    I believe you are doing the right thing by leaving the Hush out of it for now. The noise gate in the MP-2 may be all you need. You can change it from "Gate" to "Fader" in the sub menu when you are editing your programs. Gate means a hard cutoff when the signal drops below the Threshold you have set for it. Fader means the cutoff will be a bit softer and not as abrupt as the gate.

   The effects loops are nothing to be afraid of, in fact they are quite useful these days to get a much better quality guitar tone with your effects combined. To give you a better idea how this is a good thing for guitar amplifiers, let me go back into the history of how the modern guitar systems developed.

   Back in the 50's and 60's, guitar amplifiers were very simple. they had all tube circuits, and each one had it's own distinctive sound. All the amps back then were being built with the same thought in mind, to be the loudest amp out there, but to stay CLEAN the whole time. The two biggest companies who were building the best guitars and amps were Fender and Gibson. Fender was building guitars with single coils, and the amplifiers were built for these guitar with an input section that could take these guitars and keep the sound sweet. Gibson was building guitars with double coil pickups, and they were building amps that could take these guitars and keep them sounding sweet too. I think Rock and Roll was born when someone plugged a Les Paul into a Fender amp.
  Marshall amplifiers were built based on the Fender Bassman amp circuit. Jim Marshall just built a slightly different power amp circuit back then and put the whole thing in a box, then set that on top of a speaker cab with four 12" speakers. As the amps got louder, the preamp circuit stayed the same it would get hit hard with the guitar at the input, then the preamp would hit the front of the poweramp hard too. This is the kind of guitar tones you would have been hearing in the 70's and early 80's.
   But all the way up from the 50's 60's and 70's, effects were put into the front of the amplifier. ( Fuzz, distortion, wah...then later modulation effects and delay effects. There were no effects loops back then. So all the effects you were using would affect the guitar tone before it even got into the amp. If you had several of these stomp boxes, and the quality of these would vary quite a bit, if you had them all plugged in and all turned off, there would be a big difference in the sound of your guitar going into the amp, as opposed to it being plugged straight in. That was the difference between sounding like a garage band as opposed to a band produced in a high-dollar studio. In the studio, the guitar and amp tone would be recorded straight to tape (This is what is called "Dry" guitar). The tape would be played back through the mixing console and the effects would be added in the Aux sends, then blended with the original guitar tone, to preserve the quality of the guitar tone. (The percentage of how much effect is added is what is called the "wet" mix).
   Obviously, if you listened to these studio recordings they sounded great. The dilemma was, how can you get that kind of sound live when you have to go tour your new album release?
   A couple of really smart guitar player figured they would by some of these expensive studio rack processors, and connect them to their amplifiers. Well, that almost worked but we were right back to square one, plugging all this into the front of the amp and just affecting the guitar tone, instead of the guitar and amp tone. That's when techs like Jose Arrondo, Mike Soldano, Paul Rivera, and a slew of others began modifying amps, by putting in an effects loop between the preamp and poweramp sections. Now these effects could be inserted there and the guitar tone would remain solid going into the amplifier. Delays, Reverb, and Modulation effects would be inserted in the effects loop, and it would have a more subtle effect on the overall sound of the guitar and amp than it would if all of it was going into the front of the amp. So that when rack systems were born and so were multi-amp guitar rigs. When a guitar player wanted a stereo rig, he would be playing through at least three channels. His main guitar tone would be coming from his favorite amp in the center, and his effects which would be in 2-channel stereo would come from two more amplifiers on either side of his main tone. This is where we get the "Wet/Dry/Wet set up from.
   So, if you wanted to play like the big guys back in the 80's you had to have your own bank, and buy a bunch of amplifiers and expensive studio gear, hire a bunch of super techs to hook it all up for you, and lease a trucking company to haul it all around for you.
    In January of 1987, You didn't need a truck load of amplifiers anymore. ADA changed the ground rules by introducing the MP-1 Preamp. Now you could have the sound of up to 128 amplifiers in one little 19" box, that you could stick in your rack, and hook it up yourself. So here we are.

     Today, people are getting back into using stomp boxes, but many of them are also using the effects loops in their amps too. Having an Overdrive, and a Wah going into the front of the amp is useful and doesn't deteriorate your guitar tone, then plugging your Modulation, Delays, and Reverb in the effects loops gives you the rest of your effects in a signal chain that runs parallel to your original guitar signal and sums it all up at the output, without changing your basic guitar sound.

   With what you've got there MRob, the MP-2 can deliver any sound from spanking clean to the most raunchy metal tones that can even keep up with the new amplifiers coming out today. (Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier? Pfffft!!!)
   Putting your ART in the effects loop would be a good thing to do since I'm sure that has all the effects you would want to use in the loop right there. You will have to play around with the effects loops in the MP-2 to get what sounds right to your ears. Everyone is different, so we hear things differently. So don't be afraid to experiment. Try the loops at 100%, and adjust the effects level in the ART up to where you want it, then try it 50-50, then go the other way Loops at 20% and ART effect up full. See what sounds best for you. When it comes to a rig like this you have so many options available to you, it staggers the mind. The only limits are the ones you set for yourself.
   And of course, we share our presets and programming ideas with each other here, so there are plenty of jumping off points to get you going. Like Circle K, we're open 24/7 ;D

     Harley 8)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on November 22, 2016, 09:49:48 AM
One thing, if you use the effect loop of the MP-2 you need to set the mix on the ART to full wet else you can get phase sounds.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 22, 2016, 10:29:31 AM
Salient point MJMP  :thumb-up: and it's also better gain structure and allows you to get a better analogue tone (unless your Fx device has true analogue pass through for the dry sound (eg early inteliflex), so 3 very good reasons for that patching scenario (unless like me you use a mixer and run it all like a PA).

MRob, did your MXC pedal stuff come with 2 short black TRS cables ? These are used to plug the expression pedal and the quad switch into the MXC (they are midi continuous control pedals).  You plug the pedal into the "pedal one" jack on the MXC and the quad switch into the "switch one" jack on the MXC (not that you have to but is the easiest way to go). They then let you control and switch things they are "assigned" to.  E.g. you can assign the pedal to be the master output volume (which is how I use it) and the quad switch can turn on/off whatever you assign it to, out of the box it will let you toggle chorus, fx loop and tremolo and also be a tuner mute (turn the sound off while you tune). But not to confuse you for now, get your head around a basic setup like my last post and we can build on that as you understand this stuff better.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on November 22, 2016, 04:16:27 PM
Again... wow! Thank you all! That's a lot of stuff to wrap my brain around, so I'm gonna get wrapping and dig in. It's gonna take a bit, but I will keep you all posted and up to date. 

Just my anal retentiveness here, but what if I were to pick up another Mesa ported 1x12 cab??   Then I could do the stereo mix REAL justice right?   Just a thought.   :P

I'm gonna order patch cables.  The local big name music store staffed with long haired bearded teenagers has them, but they are outrageous in price, not to mention when I said "patch cables" to one of these highly trained technical guitar smith's, he looked at me like a teen that just lost their phone connection!  LOL!   :face palm:

Hence, I'm ordering a bunch... 

Thanks again guys, I will post questions as I read through everything here again.  I'm reading the MP2 Manual right now as suggested.

Have a great holiday!!
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on November 22, 2016, 05:06:28 PM
Have a great Thanksgiving MRob!

     Obviously, you can't ask for any help from the clerks at Guitar Center, they pretty much have the intellect of a house plant.

     For the most part, you have to know what you are looking for and why, and we can help you with the understanding.

     Good quality cables are a very important part of your sound, and I can't stress that enough. You can buy pre-made patch cables and I have some of those, from Monster or Planet Waves, or you can get kits to make your own from George L. The kits may seem pricey, but when you compare the price vs the number of patch cables you need to the pre-made cables, you actually come out  a little better.
     I use Monster guitar cables to plug into any of my rigs, and I've modified mine so that the jack that plugs into my guitar has a cut off switch. Switchcraft makes a heavy duty plug like that and I've soldered that to my guitar lead. Planet Waves has something like that but the jack has a push-push button on the casing to cut off the connection.
     Anyway, there is plenty of time, and the key here is not to rush things. Take it one step at a time, and before you know it, you'll have a killer sounding rig that will put your guitar out front and center.
      If you want to get another 1x12 cab to complete your rig, that's not a bad idea, especially if you are looking to get a big guitar sound. The more speakers you have broadcasting the sound of your guitar, the bigger it sounds because you are moving that much more air pressure. Just remember, you don't have to be loud to sound bigger. To me, the sound of my guitar coming from 16 12" speakers at a lower volume, is a lot more pleasing than the sound of my guitar coming from a 2x12 cab trying to keep up with the band. Of course the 2x12 cab is a lot easier to move around, so it's your choice...

    Harley 8)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on November 22, 2016, 08:55:22 PM
Hey MRob, it's good to have matching cabs and the Messa 1 x 12 seem a good choice  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on March 22, 2017, 10:31:02 PM
Hey everyone!  I am BACK for the ATTACK!   It's been a while for sure!  Here's where I am now in this rockin process

1.  I finally got a SKB 8U Rack Case.  Little did I know, this was a full, large, deep case, so it's huge!  Not really what I was looking for.. wanted a smaller foot print, so I'm going to pick up a 4 or 6 rack shallow unit.  Ughh... 

2.  Wanting smaller, I will ditch the Hush unit as advised here over and over and possibly not use the Furman power.  Not really needed from what I hear.  I can save a rack U not using it.

3.  I am going to get a second Mesa 1x12 Theile cabinet soon... this way I can go stereo as many here have said it's almost a must!

4. I still haven't tried anything yet, but I'm not traveling next week and will be home, so I may plug it all in and see what happens.

A couple more questions.
   1. Do I NEED that quadraVerb effects unit thing??  Will that make a difference?
   2.  Can I get good bluesy tone/sound from the MP2?
   3.  What other foot switching options do I have besides the old 80s looking black and red thing??  Is there something else that will work that's more up to date?  (just curious)

The new Mesa Mark V 35 has some bad ass KILLER sounds. Very tight, very articulate and pretty versatile.  Am I still better off with the MP2?

Thanks!

Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Dante on March 22, 2017, 11:20:47 PM
MRob,

Welcome back  :wave:

I had two Mesa Thiele cabs, they sound fricken awesome. Now, I have one Thiele and one 4x12 for stereo. I use the big cab for big stages, the 1x12 for little bars. The Thiele can keep up with the 4x12 just fine (I have an EV Force speaker in it).

You don't NEED the Quadraverb. In fact, there are several other FX devices out there that are probably better. Shop around. Pretty much any FX device is fine, if it provides you with what you need. I found a Boss GX-700 nearby for cheap, so I tried it. Now I have two.

You can absolutely get a good bluesy tone from the MP-2, regardless of how you define bluesy. It can give you that clean round tone from the neck PU that sounds like a hollow body...provided you feed it with quality equipment (guitar, pickups, etc.). It can also give you that overdriven clean tone that borders on searing crunch. You can get pretty much ANY tone from the MP-2. The one knock I have is the picking attack can be lacking at times....pretty minor thing really.

Use any midi footswitch with your midi gear, your preference decides which is best.

I am not familiar with that particular Mesa, but it has been my experience that:
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on March 23, 2017, 12:06:24 AM
Dante - Thanks Brother!  Greatly appreciate the info. 

I saw an Alesis Quadraverb the other day at a store for 60 bones.  Is that better than what I have? 

See, I thought ADA has fx in it for each preset?? 

Also, what's your take on my set up...?  No Furman, No Hush, Scale it down...?? 
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on March 23, 2017, 04:28:46 PM
I'm looking at midi foot controllers for my set up. Came across the new Mastermind LT.  Would this work for the ADA MP2??

Also, wanted to ask another fundamental potentially dumb question.  How do I run my Wah and Boss Tuner with my set up?  Just in line as normal? 

I will be firing this thing up this week, so I will let you know how it sounds.  I've been playing though a Boss ME 80 going through studio monitor speakers at low levels at home.  Haven't gigged in over a year and haven't played through anything substantial since then.  "Then" I was playing through a Mark V 90w head that I sold, so I'm hoping for quite a big difference from the little ME 80. 

The Mark V was big and heavy and difficult for me to get the sound I wanted... I wasn't a HUGE fan of it, but I don't think I was utilizing as I should have been.  Again, I'm an 80s guy and am Jones'in for that Nuno, Skid Row heavy rockin, in your face, guitar sound! 

Some have said I don't need the Furman power conditioner... I'm assuming just go with a good small powerstrip and be done with it?  Saving rack space...??


Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MarshallJMP on March 24, 2017, 02:51:15 AM
Unless you want to use it on a PC/mac I think this pedal is a bit overkill and quite expensive. The best pedal IMHO is an ADA MXC pedal pack. Works perfect with the MP-2.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on March 24, 2017, 07:10:10 AM
I agree with MJMP on the MXC pedal pack.  The standard pedal pack was 1 x MXC pedal (which phantom powers from the MP2 with 7 pin midi lead and wall wart plugs into the back of MP2), 1 X CC expression pedal and 1 x CC Quad switch.  The MXC can accommodate 2 x expression pedals (say one for stereo master vol and one for wah) and 2 x Quad switches.  Unless you want to do much more complicated midi setups with lots of other midi gear/gadgets, it's all you'll ever need and still modern enough.  They are also road reliable (I can attest after 25 + years).

I use a QV for delay and reverb (it does much more (flange, phase, leslie, eq, etc).  Lots of other gadgets do this quite well also, but for $60, quite a good score if it's in decent nick although doesn't have midi continuous control (CC) capabilities like some of the later model units (e.g. the TC GMaj2 is a very good unit and many here like it).

Some like the Furman, very expensive and, if you have decent power, not really required (albeit a convenient power strip in the rack). In Australia, I've never needed one or similar except when I play off generators (MP2s don't like generators much). So I bought a $180 1Kva UPS (like you buy for computers) just for that purpose.
The MP2 has a built in noise gate (which you only need for the very high gain patches) so you don't need the hush.
Tuner and Wah go up front, just like normal.  But if you prefer the MP2 wah (controlled with expression pedal (I use triggered wah, no pedal req, whas when you pluck) then you don't need another up front  :dunno: .  The MP2 wah is very early in the MP2 circuit (check the flow chart at front of the manual), much the same as in front.  The MXC quad switch has (by default) one button assigned to tuner mute (cuts MP2 vol for tuning).  If you'd really like to be in tune though, get a Peterson strobe tuner, I use the strobo clip, best $75 I've ever spent  :thumb-up: . They (as are all strobe tuners) much better (more accurate) than the standard digital ones (which have a wide "dead zone" and the Boss ones are one of the widest I've come across over many years  :facepalm: ).
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on March 24, 2017, 07:31:28 AM
    I'll elaborate a little on what Richard said but expand on it a little. If you have good power at home and you don't plan to gig with the MP-2, then you don't need a Furman. If you are going to go play out with it, then I would whole-heartedly recommend you use a Furman, or compatible power conditioner. Voltage spikes and brownouts are common in bars, and while neon lights and coolers may possibly introduce noise in your rig, the bigger issue is to protect your gear from severe spikes.
    Furmans are not THAT expensive, depending on the model you choose. A PL-8 will do just fine for a bar rig, and you can pick them up used, they're just as good as new ones.
    The Wah in the MP-2 is quite useable, and sounds decent if you set it right.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on March 24, 2017, 08:59:50 AM
GREAT info!  Man this forum is awesome.   

Ok, so I HAVE a good furman in storage, I was just trying to save rack space.  From what I've read so far, I will use a 6 space rack and use the Furman... done deal there. 

AND, I have the ADA Pedal pack... BUT it's the older one.   All I really want to do is be able to go between patches.  I don't want or need anything complicated...

i will be firing it up soon!

Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on March 24, 2017, 04:16:23 PM
Hi MRob,

     If you have the MXC, Quad Switch, and CCP, then that's all you need for your MP-2 rig, and it's completely up to date. Your rig is a simple one, which is good to start with. You don't want to get overwhelmed.
    It will automatically be set up for program changes as soon as you plug it in. The trickiest thing would be MIDI mapping, or MIDI control of your ART processor with the MP-2, but we know how to take care of that.
    A 5 or 6 space rack case would be the best option. I was never a fan of SKB cases, but that's a matter of personal preference.
    You would have all the tones/effects you would ever need with just that basic set up. You could (if you wanted to), insert the ME 80 in the loop too, but why would you want to? You already have all the clean/distortion sounds in the MP-2 and all points in between, with everything else already there, and the ME 80 would just complicate your signal levels.
    Keep everything as simple as possible, and you'll have a great sounding rig that will be as versatile as you need it to be, without a lot of headaches.

   Harley 8)
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: MRob on March 24, 2017, 06:38:16 PM
Harley!  Thank you and everyone here for your great words and wisdom.  YES!  Simple and with minimal to no headaches.

I like things clean and simple with little complication... so much so that, I've been looking VERY hard at the new Mesa Mark V 35!
That little thing is a beast and sounds freakin amazing!  Wow!  Pop that bad boy on top of a couple 1x12s and i'm done.
Or... am I?  Hmmm... while I like simple I also like chorus and delay and a few other things.  When I play live I really only use abut 3-4 different sounds, but I want those sounds to be solid and to kick ass!   Then again, isn't that what we ALL want?  LOL!

I have the ADA MP2 and it's just been sitting there... and I have been jones'in for that 80's big guitar sound SINCE the 80s and from what I read, and with what I "currently" have, apparently, I HAVE it! :)  So, we will see.   

I want that tight rocking guitar sound that remains articulate with the notes, has a heavy chunk and remains tight! 


Now... speaking of simple, when I look at those three pieces of black and red foot controllers, I don't see simple...??  Do I need all of those pieces?  Ha!    I'm planning on reading the manuals tonight. 

Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: rnolan on March 24, 2017, 07:25:48 PM
Hey MRob, well sounds to me like you'll get just what you want with the MP2 rig.  It's worked well for me for 20+ years  :thumb-up: Only difference is I use a QV for effects (as that was what was available back then).  As Harley says the Art will do you fine.  Like you I use 3 or 4 sounds these days, very simple.
To change patches all you need is the MXC.  The exp pedal and quad switch plug into the MXC (marked on the back, pedal1 pedal 2 switch 1 switch 2). They use small stereo leads. But you don't need to use either of them (for many years I didn't).
However, the one I find most useful is the exp pedal.  I assign that to the MP2s master stereo vol, good for fine tuning vols when playing and turn vol off between songs.  This is easy to set up BTW, you plug the exp pedal into pedal 1 on MXC, then in the MP2 global midi menu (system edit) find stereo master vol (there's a menu map in the manual), move the pedal (MP2 senses the move and assigns the exp pedals CC number (#31 IIRC)) and it's done.  On start up you need to sweep the pedal once for it to activate, then it controls the MP2s output level.  BTW this is the only way you can access the MP2s st master vol feature.  I tend to use the same patch for both lead and rhythm these days and use the vol pedal for the lead boost.
Title: Re: NEW To Racks - Have ADA Gear - please advise
Post by: Harley Hexxe on March 25, 2017, 05:49:14 AM
Hi MRob,

     Actually, the Foot switches are very simple and when you try them out, you'll probably end up asking yourself: "Why didn't I do this a long time ago?"
    As Richard says, the MXC will handle all your program changes...why so many buttons? Simple. Who plays with one tone all night long? With the MXC, you can save 10 different combinations of tones and effects. Most people use only 3-4 basic tones for a whole gig, and then just add or remove effects as desired. You can do all of this with these pedals. Try programming and saving your Rhythm tones on the bottom row buttons, and your lead tones across the top row. Have all the effects you want to possibly use, programmed into each of these preset locations also, even if you don't want them to be on all the time. I'll explain why next.
    Your Quad Switch is a very simple, but very handy item because  the four buttons serve a very important purpose. One button will bypass/activate your effects loops, the next one will do the same for your chorus, the next one for your tremolo/vibrato, and the last one is a tuner mute button. The beauty of it is, you don't have to program the preamp or the switch to do these things, it's already setup like that as soon as you plug them in. It doesn't get any easier than that.
    The CCP is almost as easy if you want to use it for your Wah pedal, and it works great for that. All you need to do is tell the MP-2 what kind of wah you want to use it as, and set the range, which I found is good at 70%-75%. Save it, and your good to go. When you want your wah on, you just step on it like any other stand alone wah, (toe all the way forward). to turn it on and off.

   Truthfully, I think you will have the hardest time trying to decide which tone you want to keep when you are editing. I believe you'll be like a kid in a candy store with NO supervision  :lol: You'll get so wrapped up in the spanking cleans, the singing crunches, the gnarly distortion/overdrives, and the "Ice-Pick-In-The-Forehead" Metal tones that you get out of the MP-2, that you'll totally lose track of time...until the police come knocking on your door after hours. C:-)
    By the way, I should mention there is a vid on Youtube where a guy puts the MP-2 up against a Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier. The MP-2 nails it, no problem.

    ...Anything else you want to know....we are always here :thumb-up: