Anyone have a good idea what an MP1 is worth? - I am pondering selling mine to go towards a Les Paul but prices on eBay and Reverb seem all over the place...
Mine is a later (no switch on top)version with firmware 2.01, 240v with JMP's noise mods, tidy.
I am not yet sure about selling but a realistic idea of its value may help me decide...
Any clues what I should ask for?
That's a good question - as you say, prices are all over the map. I say, get as much as you can, while you can. If there is a sudden glut of MP1s on Reverb and they're all overpriced, start up your ad with a slightly lower price (it'll probably still be double what you paid for it)
Go get your Les Paul
Thank you Dante for your answer and encouragement!
I can't even remember what I paid when I bought it new all those years ago! I chose the MP1 plus ADA B200 and a Marshall 4 x 12 over a Mesa Boogie mk4 after a music shop allowed me to take it all home for a weekend in order to decide!
Well new (back in the day) they were very expensive. IIRC back in the late 80's I paid over $1500 AUD for my MP-1 (pretty much the first one in Australia), the present day value of that is over $4000AUD. You also need to consider that you are selling the later hardware version (no top switch or line level rear jack), the last EPROM available (2.01) and noise mods all done (so value added, nothing much for buyer to do/spend on it, (BTW is the battery mod done??) except maybe Tubes).
Just had a look at reverb and evilbay listings, they are all north of $1000 USD and, from others' experience, the price doesn't grantee a good one.
My guess is 1200 Eros (since your in France?) is a fair price. :wave: However, I would hold onto it so you've got something awesome to play your new LP through and find something else to sell to help that purchase. IMHO, the ADA preamps are "still" the best available (albeit 2nd hand now).
Quote from: rnolan on January 16, 2024, 08:35:49 PM
Well new (back in the day) they were very expensive. IIRC back in the late 80's I paid over $1500 AUD for my MP-1 (pretty much the first one in Australia), the present day value of that is over $4000AUD. You also need to consider that you are selling the later hardware version (no top switch or line level rear jack), the last EPROM available (2.01) and noise mods all done (so value added, nothing much for buyer to do/spend on it, (BTW is the battery mod done??) except maybe Tubes).
Just had a look at reverb and evilbay listings, they are all north of $1000 USD and, from others' experience, the price doesn't grantee a good one.
My guess is 1200 Eros (since your in France?) is a fair price. :wave: However, I would hold onto it so you've got something awesome to play your new LP through and find something else to sell to help that purchase. IMHO, the ADA preamps are "still" the best available (albeit 2nd hand now).
Thank you for your helpful reply! I had forgotten how expensive it was!
Yes, I have also done the battery mod.
I do have some misgivings about whether or not to sell the MP1 but in reality I only use it occasionally. My rack with MP1, Alesis Quadraverb, Rocktron Xpression and Marshall 9100 with 4 x 12 just sit gathering dust as nowadays I just use my self built 18 watt Marshall clone.
I am still undecided...
Nice MP-1 rig :thumb-up:
Quote from: rnolan on January 17, 2024, 01:48:17 AM
Nice MP-1 rig :thumb-up:
Thank you - yes, but bulky...
Hey vmaxvmax,
I've been watching this thread and I think it's time to speak up about a possibility that could happen; Seller's Remorse.
You've got a decent little rack rig there that can give you all kinds of different amp/effect tones when you want them. If the 18 watt plexi is the only tone you want, then you may seriously think about selling your MP-1. If there is a possibility that you may get the urge to go with an amp tone that is completely different, and you have already sold the MP-1, then you won't have that option available and that's when you'll feel the first pangs of seller's remorse.
I'm only throwing this out there because I've been there. Not just with amplifiers, but guitars too. I've sold off a LOT of tube amps that I had and sometimes I wish I had kept one or two of them. MP-1s, I've sold many of them, and right after I did, I ended up buying another to replace it. I have every ADA preamp these days, and I don't think of selling them anymore because I know better. Each one has a different character than the others, and when I want a specific amp tone, I can get it. No matter what amp tone it is. I have several modeling amplifiers these days that I mess around with, and they're good, but not quite as good as my ADA gear.
Just something to think about
Harley 8)
Quote from: Harley Hexxe on January 17, 2024, 02:32:25 PM
Hey vmaxvmax,
I've been watching this thread and I think it's time to speak up about a possibility that could happen; Seller's Remorse.
You've got a decent little rack rig there that can give you all kinds of different amp/effect tones when you want them. If the 18 watt plexi is the only tone you want, then you may seriously think about selling your MP-1. If there is a possibility that you may get the urge to go with an amp tone that is completely different, and you have already sold the MP-1, then you won't have that option available and that's when you'll feel the first pangs of seller's remorse.
I'm only throwing this out there because I've been there. Not just with amplifiers, but guitars too. I've sold off a LOT of tube amps that I had and sometimes I wish I had kept one or two of them. MP-1s, I've sold many of them, and right after I did, I ended up buying another to replace it. I have every ADA preamp these days, and I don't think of selling them anymore because I know better. Each one has a different character than the others, and when I want a specific amp tone, I can get it. No matter what amp tone it is. I have several modeling amplifiers these days that I mess around with, and they're good, but not quite as good as my ADA gear.
Just something to think about
Harley 8)
Hey, thank you for your thoughts Harley!
Over the years I sold two early 60's AC30's (at different times) and often regretted that...
So yes, I don't want to regret anything later.
Wise words Harley +1 :thumb-up:
Not so much wisdom as it is experience Richard,
If I may remind you, just a little over a year ago...the guitar I bought that I used to own two of. 1983 Stratocaster Elite.
I missed those guitars so much after I sold both of them, that I bought one exactly like one of the ones I sold, it cost me over four times what I paid for the other ones. It's experience, but it cost me. :facepalm:
Hey Harley, well to some extent wisdom is informed by experience (wisdom: the quality of having experience, knowledge, and good judgement)... (experience certainly rubs it in LoL). Thanks for the reminder, I do remember and empathise :wave: .
Richard,
I'm kind of finding myself in that situation right now once again. I'm thinking of selling my 2007 VG Stratocaster, which is the newest USA made Strat I have. There's nothing wrong with it at all in fact, it's a very good quality built guitar with a lot of extra features that you don't get in a stock Stratocaster. I just had it professionally overhauled and set up at Lay's Guitar Shop last month, and the action is perfect. It plays like a dream, and holds it's tuning very well.
The reason I'm thinking of selling it is because I also have a 2016 CG-1 Roland ready Strat. That is a MIM Strat that is already set up with the GK-3 pickup and electronics. I can buy a Boss GP-10 and plug it into that guitar and it will give me all that I get out of the VG Strat, and a lot more. That would also be an excellent fly-rig too for places that won't let me bring an amplifier. Having that rig kind of makes the VG Strat a bit redundant, which is why I'm thinking of selling it.
Here's the dilemma: while the CG-1 offers me all the versatility I could possibly want in a guitar, the build quality isn't as good as the USA guitar. I've had to replace the tuning machines, the bridge, the nut and the pickups. The neck on the CG-1 is more like the vintage neck profiles which I prefer over the modern "C" shape. However, I've been checking out the newer Fender USA guitars, and it seems like the quality has been slipping again at Fender. So...what do I do here? Keep it and just use it as a stock Strat, or sell it since I already have two others like that with vintage neck profiles?
I've come to the conclusion that if I have any doubts about selling something that really can deliver flawlessly when I need it, then don't sell it because there's a good possibility I'll regret it. It's the same way with amps and effects.
Harley 8)
Quote from: Harley Hexxe on January 20, 2024, 03:02:39 AM
Richard,
I'm kind of finding myself in that situation right now once again. I'm thinking of selling my 2007 VG Stratocaster, which is the newest USA made Strat I have. There's nothing wrong with it at all in fact, it's a very good quality built guitar with a lot of extra features that you don't get in a stock Stratocaster. I just had it professionally overhauled and set up at Lay's Guitar Shop last month, and the action is perfect. It plays like a dream, and holds it's tuning very well.
The reason I'm thinking of selling it is because I also have a 2016 CG-1 Roland ready Strat. That is a MIM Strat that is already set up with the GK-3 pickup and electronics. I can buy a Boss GP-10 and plug it into that guitar and it will give me all that I get out of the VG Strat, and a lot more. That would also be an excellent fly-rig too for places that won't let me bring an amplifier. Having that rig kind of makes the VG Strat a bit redundant, which is why I'm thinking of selling it.
Here's the dilemma: while the CG-1 offers me all the versatility I could possibly want in a guitar, the build quality isn't as good as the USA guitar. I've had to replace the tuning machines, the bridge, the nut and the pickups. The neck on the CG-1 is more like the vintage neck profiles which I prefer over the modern "C" shape. However, I've been checking out the newer Fender USA guitars, and it seems like the quality has been slipping again at Fender. So...what do I do here? Keep it and just use it as a stock Strat, or sell it since I already have two others like that with vintage neck profiles?
I've come to the conclusion that if I have any doubts about selling something that really can deliver flawlessly when I need it, then don't sell it because there's a good possibility I'll regret it. It's the same way with amps and effects.
Harley 8)
True! A good yardstick.
Hey Harley, if it were me, I'd keep the 2007 VG. But then I've only ever sold one guitar and still regret it :facepalm: . But of course money comes into it. I sold my original MP-1 rig to MikeB (I kept the Quadverb) years ago so I could afford the MP-2 when it came, only because that's the only way I could afford to back then. I also sold a 100w Marshall Artist head, which I was using to run stereo before I got the MP-1 rig sorted with a B200s and I wasn't particularly "attached" to it, and bought a pair of Split Stacks.
Seems, from what you are saying, you are having doubts, so obviously keep it :thumb-up: .
I'm deliberating over my Squire bullet strat at the moment, I changed all the hardware (tuners, bridge, nut, PUs, pots (to push pull), super switch (so its like LP switching i.e. middle poss is bridge and neck PU) and the B and N pickup have their own push pull (series/parallel) vol control. But the neck is large(ish) C profile which I don't like (I prefer a soft V) and I'd like to put stainless steel frets in it. If I had a work bench set up I'd reshape the neck and refret it, but I don't so I've been thinking of buying a premade neck.... But the idea of throwing way an ok neck bothers me.
Quote from: vmaxvmax on January 20, 2024, 03:14:42 AM
True! A good yardstick.
vmaxvamax,
In your case, I would just point out that you can dial in the current tone you're getting from the 18 watt Marshall amp you built into the MP-1, and still have a lot more tones on hand should you ever want to record and add different guitar textures. That's what made the MP-1 so unique when it was introduced in 1987. You don't need a warehouse full of amplifiers to get the sounds you want with that in your tool box.
I should also mention that when I sold off all those MP-1s years ago, I wouldn't ask for more than $100 USD for them. Look how much they are going for now. It's ridiculous.
Richard,
I wouldn't throw away the neck, I'd put it up for sale on ebay or something like that. You and I share similar taste in that we both prefer the soft "V" neck, and that's the neck on my 1983 '57 RI Strat. I know the profile you're talking about on the Squire neck, and I have no idea where Fender came up with that. The modern "C" neck on the USA Strat is similar in it's bulkiness, but it has rolled edges which does make it more comfortable even with the added girth, and the fret work from the factory is top tier. The luthier I took it to suggested that I replace it with a MIM neck, but they vary according to model. I think if I replaced it with any neck at all, it would be an EC signature neck since that one is a "V" neck and it also has 22 frets. All the other "V" necks are only available in 21 frets.
One thing I didn't mention about the CG-1 Strat is that the fret ends on the neck stick out from both sides of the fret board. That needs some serious attention. I could also get him to carve the "V" profile into that one and it would be a great feeling neck to play. As you mentioned, money comes into play here, as it always does when it comes to gear. I'm not really attached to the VG Strat, and the money I'd get from the sale of it would go towards finishing the CG-1 Strat. If I were to keep it, I would have the LSR nut installed, and replace the tuners with locking tuners. But again, it would only be used as a standard Strat. All the electronics in it would be a waste. I could probably get $1200 USD for it right now with all the stuff it comes with, (HSC, extra battery pack & owner's manual). MIM necks are going for right around $300 USD, and USA made necks are easily twice that and up. The STRATosphere is a good source for these necks.
Quote from: Harley Hexxe on January 21, 2024, 03:11:57 AM
Quote from: vmaxvmax on January 20, 2024, 03:14:42 AM
True! A good yardstick.
vmaxvamax,
In your case, I would just point out that you can dial in the current tone you're getting from the 18 watt Marshall amp you built into the MP-1, and still have a lot more tones on hand should you ever want to record and add different guitar textures. That's what made the MP-1 so unique when it was introduced in 1987. You don't need a warehouse full of amplifiers to get the sounds you want with that in your tool box.
I should also mention that when I sold off all those MP-1s years ago, I wouldn't ask for more than $100 USD for them. Look how much they are going for now. It's ridiculous.
Mmm... You are right of course - but will I ever really need it again?
I know that it is most unlikely that I'll be hauling my 4 x 12 and rack gear around any more. I use my 18 watt combo (sometimes re-amped via a reactive load into the Marshall 9100) plus an extension cab nowadays for gigs and for recording. I do also sometimes connect a JCM800 preamp clone I built to the Marshall 9100. I think the last time I used my MP1 for a gig was 16 plus years ago and the last time I used my 4 x 12 was about ten years ago.
Funny thing talking about regrets... I used to have an early 70's Orange 4 x 12. It weighed a ton (much heavier than my Marshall 4 x 12) - so I chopped it up and binned the wood :facepalm: . I kept the four, now vintage, Celestion G12H30's. I subsequently lost one, god know's where, but I still have the other three two of which are in my combo and the extension cab!
I also binned a Sound City 4 x 12 with Fanes because it didn't have any value in the late 70's/early 80's... That was after throwing the speakers into the bin and using the empty cab as a support to raise my Marshall 4 x 12 up to ear level ::). I live with that still in the form of mild tinnitus... Living next door to the cymbals on stage probably didn't help much.
Then there was my lovely Roost 100 watt amp. Like a Hiwatt - stiff and loud. What happened to that? I didn't sell it but I don't have it either...
Not much point talking about all the 'worthless' pedals that somehow have become valuable once they disappeared somewhere or other.
Mind you, making a positive decision to sell the MP1 is a different thing to binning and losing stuff. ;D
Hey vmaxvmax, one consideration (among the many LoL) is you have a really good specked up MP-1, all the right stuff done etc. They are much harder to find (and expensive) should you ever want one again. Seems to me you could use your spare Celestion G12H30 and make another extension cab (so now you have 2 :whoohoo!: ) and run the ADA rig through that (obviously careful with the volume so you don't blow them up). Thus no quad box to lug (maybe sell it??).
Maybe to help your decision, run the MP-1 rig up in stereo (which you don't get with the 18w clone thingy) and remember how fu#king amazing it sounds. I built a nice MP-2 rig (MP-2, Alesis midverb3, B200s, Peavey stereo quad box) for a friend a while ago. Over time (much like you) he wasn't using it (opting for a small Fender combo amp) and was going to sell it (just the rack not the cab). He offered it to me and I said ok I'll buy it (not that I need it) but only after he runs it up again and is sure he wants to part with it. So he ran it up and is now thinking to keep it.
A few years ago I bought 2 MP-1s, one working one not, again I didn't need them but the price was right ($600 AUD for the MP-1s, a custom plywood rack). So I fired up the working MP-1 and then compared it to my '73 Marshall 50. The Marshall sounded like a toy in comparison (albeit it was my main amp for many many years). ADA gear is special (hence this forum), the MP-1 is the last thing I'd sell (if I were you).
Hey Harley, I hadn't thought of selling the neck, good idea if I went that way. Maybe I need to find a friend with a work bench and just reshape and refret it. I hate the idea of wasting it, even though it's just a cheap Squire neck, the wood is ok, the rosewood FB is a bit thick on those (so tone suck) and I would like 22 frets. There's a mob in Melbourne https://mrfabulous.com.au/product-category/bodies-and-necks/guitar-necks/ (https://mrfabulous.com.au/product-category/bodies-and-necks/guitar-necks/) that have necks for a good price. However, they don't quote dimensions (bullet strat is narrower) or profile (and soft V is your and my preference) or fretwire (and I want stainless). The Mr Fabulous neck I'm attracted to is https://mrfabulous.com.au/product/strat-neck-rrosewood-roasted-str-rst/ (https://mrfabulous.com.au/product/strat-neck-rrosewood-roasted-str-rst/) pretty reasonable value at $130 AUD but there isn't enough detail, ok it's 9.5" radius, 22 frets, that's all ok, 10mm tuner holes, I'd probably have to ream them for the Gotohs, no big deal but they don't quote the nut, 12th fret widths and neck pocket dimensions (which seems unusual).
Quote from: rnolan on January 22, 2024, 01:30:47 AM
Hey vmaxvmax, one consideration (among the many LoL) is you have a really good specked up MP-1, all the right stuff done etc. They are much harder to find (and expensive) should you ever want one again. Seems to me you could use your spare Celestion G12H30 and make another extension cab (so now you have 2 :whoohoo!: ) and run the ADA rig through that (obviously careful with the volume so you don't blow them up). Thus no quad box to lug (maybe sell it??).
Maybe to help your decision, run the MP-1 rig up in stereo (which you don't get with the 18w clone thingy) and remember how fu#king amazing it sounds. I built a nice MP-2 rig (MP-2, Alesis midverb3, B200s, Peavey stereo quad box) for a friend a while ago. Over time (much like you) he wasn't using it (opting for a small Fender combo amp) and was going to sell it (just the rack not the cab). He offered it to me and I said ok I'll buy it (not that I need it) but only after he runs it up again and is sure he wants to part with it. So he ran it up and is now thinking to keep it.
A few years ago I bought 2 MP-1s, one working one not, again I didn't need them but the price was right ($600 AUD for the MP-1s, a custom plywood rack). So I fired up the working MP-1 and then compared it to my '73 Marshall 50. The Marshall sounded like a toy in comparison (albeit it was my main amp for many many years). ADA gear is special (hence this forum), the MP-1 is the last thing I'd sell (if I were you).
I think you and Harley Hexxe have run a good campaign to persuade me not to sell...
I did use to run the rack in stereo but that was with two 4 x 12's. It sounded great but after about a year of that I couldn't be bothered to lug it all around for 2 or 3 gigs a week. It got to the point where my only memories of the gigs was the packing down afterwards! I didn't have the luxury of a guitar roadie...
Why hadn't I thought about another 1 x 12 cab and a portable stereo rig with the MP1 and the 9100? It now seems too obvious! Wouldn't be much bulkier nor heavier than the 18 watt clone + extension! Plus I could melt the ears off my bass player like the old days - if he wasn't as deaf as me! I could use the 18 watt clone as a second extension to see how it goes.
Mind you, the 9100 is frighteningly heavy...
:whoohoo!: now your talking. You could swap out the 9100 (a good idea since the speakers are only 30w :nono: ) and get a single RU SS or hybrid amp. I use a Carvin DCM 200L in one of my racks. Sounds great with guitar preamps and so light. And there's other in the mix that are similar. What impedance are the G12H30?
Quote from: rnolan on January 22, 2024, 04:02:30 AM
:whoohoo!: now your talking. You could swap out the 9100 (a good idea since the speakers are only 30w :nono: ) and get a single RU SS or hybrid amp. I use a Carvin DCM 200L in one of my racks. Sounds great with guitar preamps and so light. And there's other in the mix that are similar. What impedance are the G12H30?
Funnily enough I have just recently given away an Art SLA100... I wasn't using it. ::)
The Celestions are 15 ohms.
I have also made a 3116 class D amp which runs at around 50 watts. They come in the form of a very small PCB and fit inside a small pedal sized Hammond enclosure. Running at 24 vdc from a laptop psu they are surprisingly powerful and sound good. A couple would easily fit inside a Hammond enclosure - could be a small light way to power a couple of Celestions!
Maybe I should sell the 9100...
Quote from: vmaxvmax on January 22, 2024, 02:57:27 AM
I did use to run the rack in stereo but that was with two 4 x 12's. It sounded great but after about a year of that I couldn't be bothered to lug it all around for 2 or 3 gigs a week. It got to the point where my only memories of the gigs was the packing down afterwards! I didn't have the luxury of a guitar roadie...
Why hadn't I thought about another 1 x 12 cab and a portable stereo rig with the MP1 and the 9100? It now seems too obvious! Wouldn't be much bulkier nor heavier than the 18 watt clone + extension! Plus I could melt the ears off my bass player like the old days - if he wasn't as deaf as me! I could use the 18 watt clone as a second extension to see how it goes.
Mind you, the 9100 is frighteningly heavy...
I did that for years, lugging around two 4x12 cabs playing in smallish bars. It was crazy, I was young, strong and dumb - haha. But yes, it sounded AMAZING.
I sold my JCM800 halfstack and kept my Carvin 4x12 to run stereo. Now, I have my two 1x12s. Small, light, big stereo sound.
Also like you, I haven't played my ADA rig out in about 15 years now, when my MP2 let me down at a gig. I have had it repaired since, and had my MP1 Classic all 'gone thru' by our own MJMP. Now, they are for jamming with friends because I can't fix them and they're just a bit too delicate for my gorilla-like finesse in loading in/out.
Here's a pic of how I run it now, using a multi effect on the floor to control the channels via midi, running the FX via 4 cable method
(http://adadepot.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2871.0;attach=4779)
Here's a pic of how I run it now, using a multi effect on the floor to control the channels via midi, running the FX via 4 cable method
(http://adadepot.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2871.0;attach=4779)
[/quote]
Looks very portable! Encouragement for me to give it a shot at my next rehearsal this week.
Wow, did I start something?
All I was doing was pointing out the possibility that you might regret selling a piece of gear that's in good shape. Richard did point out something else that I wasn't thinking about, (good one Richard :thumb-up: ), that if you went looking for another MP-1 to replace the one you sold, you might end up with a boner. (Anyone remember what Danny went through a couple of years ago buying MP-1s?)
Vmaxvamx, it sounds like you've got a handle on the portable power amps, and you should give it a try. If you do go with a pair of 1x12 cabs, make sure they are open back. You'll get much better projection that way.
Yes, those Monoblock 9100 amps are good if you're going to play a very large venue, or maybe an outdoor venue, but definitely over-kill in a small club. Heck, I've played sports auditoriums with just my 40 watt Fender Vibrolux, and filled the place with the sound of my guitar. Unless you're going to go do something like I mentioned above, yeah, selling that power amp would be easier on your back.
Richard,
You could sand the neck down by hand until it has the feel you want from it. What I would do is leave the finish on it so I can see the area I'm sanding until I reach the desired contour, then strip the rest and re-finish it. The rosewood isn't a tone suck, it mellows out the sharp highs a little. If there's a graphite, or plastic nut on the other hand, THAT is a tone suck, Bone or brass is a good nut material, but I like the LSR roller nuts. Zero chance of binding the strings, and a very much alive guitar tone. A bit of a pain in the a$$ to install, but worth it IMHO.
Most places that sell necks don't quote 12th fret width, or neck heel width. About half don't quote nut widths. I guess they assume you're building a guitar from scratch and will accommodate what they have :dunno: I suppose you could email them and ask for those dimensions and see what they say.
Quote from: Harley Hexxe on January 22, 2024, 01:57:55 PM
Wow, did I start something?
All I was doing was pointing out the possibility that you might regret selling a piece of gear that's in good shape. Richard did point out something else that I wasn't thinking about, (good one Richard :thumb-up: ), that if you went looking for another MP-1 to replace the one you sold, you might end up with a boner. (Anyone remember what Danny went through a couple of years ago buying MP-1s?)
Vmaxvamx, it sounds like you've got a handle on the portable power amps, and you should give it a try. If you do go with a pair of 1x12 cabs, make sure they are open back. You'll get much better projection that way.
Yes, those Monoblock 9100 amps are good if you're going to play a very large venue, or maybe an outdoor venue, but definitely over-kill in a small club. Heck, I've played sports auditoriums with just my 40 watt Fender Vibrolux, and filled the place with the sound of my guitar. Unless you're going to go do something like I mentioned above, yeah, selling that power amp would be easier on your back.
Yes I think you did star something!
And yes, my existing cab is open backed and any potential additions would be too.
@ vmaxvmax, bummer about the ART SLA100, would have been perfect. I'm not a fan of D class amps for guitar. 2 reasons, 1. I'm an analogue die hard :facepalm: and D class use pulses to "transduce" the signal (similar "conceptually" to A/D - D/A conversion albeit a different technique) so there goes your analogue signal flow and 2. they sound a bit stark and clinical, good for bass and PA etc. not so great for guitar. But they are very convenient from a size, power and weight perspective. And you say they sound good so they should work for you. Remember with SS amps the higher the impedance (yours are 15 ohms (that's a bit odd, they are typically 4, 8 or 16 ohms)), the less power they put out. There's a formula for it but basically a 100w SS amp will deliver say 100w into 4 ohms, around 75w into 8 ohms and around 50w into 16ohms. Conversely 16ohm speakers are typically more sensitive and efficient than 8ohm and 8ohm typically more efficient than 4 ohm etc. Tube power amps have an output transformer and aren't affected in quite the same way by speaker impedance.
@Dante, that's a nice rig my friend :thumb-up: . What died in your MP-2 way back when? My main MP-2 I bought new back in the early 90's has never missed a beat (it does get shitty when I run it on flaky generator power so I bought the 1.5KVA battery UPS for those moments). And it's still going strong (touch wood LoL)
@ Harley, yes sanding it is an option, and I'm considering that possibility. Mr Fabulous are in Melbourne so I can phone them and chat, the price is good $130 AUD, and maybe they would make a custom neck for me, I can ask. Re the rosewood, do you remember the posts about this ages ago (I just went looking for the web page/article re electric guitar woods and it's disappeared :-( ) and the reason Leo Fender went for a really thin rosewood veneer was that it sucks tone a bit. I like rosewood to play on, absorbs sweat and fights me a bit (which I like), but my fav is the Pau Fero FB on my Anderson (IIRC you not a fan of Pau Fero LoL). It's been fantastic for 37+ years now and also the stainless frets he used/uses are still good (allegedly Anderson have their own specific stainless concoction).
An yes I do remember Danny's MP-1 journey, I was a bit gob smacked that he went through so many (was it more than 10?) and only found one that was ok (ish) and he liked (even though they were all advertised as working well). Which IIRC he sold/gave to MJMP (his "holey grail" MP-1) and gave up on the whole idea. This memory (plus others' experiences on here), hence my comment regarding keeping a good one if you have it :thumb-up: .
So I'm in the process a rejuvenating a very old 2 x 12 cab I've had for 40 years (down sizing like you guys :thumb-up: ). I gave it to MikeB but he gave it back recently. So far a friend has put a piece of marine ply down the centre so I can run it stereo (which I mostly did way back anyway) but the ply should assist with limiting phase cancellation/flanging. It has ~6"x5" ports behind each speaker, so not open back but vented. and I just ordered the speakers for it https://www.lorantz.com.au/loudspeaker-products/loud-speakers/12-inch-guitar/ac304u100-mi-12-inch-guitar/ (https://www.lorantz.com.au/loudspeaker-products/loud-speakers/12-inch-guitar/ac304u100-mi-12-inch-guitar/) The description says they work better in vented (like I have) cabs rather than open back. Lorantz also make pretty amazing green back clones. They are also in Melbourne so shipping wont kill me (speakers are heavy). I do have an ADA Slant split stack that I wired stereo (with Celestion GT75s 16 ohm in it), got it from a pawn shop ages ago. It's ok but I get quite a bit of flanging with it and to put a separator in it is very problematic as, being a sealed cab, the only internal access is via the speaker holes. I was contemplating a bit of cardboard and gaph taping it in, as I could bend that through the speaker opening and then flatten out, but then I got the other cab back, which is a better shape, wider and not so tall and the back panel is screwed on. I made a 4 pin SpeaKON to 2 x 1/4" jack lead for it the other day. The speakers are 100w 8ohm and will work with all 3 power amps I have (ADA B200s, Carvin DCM200l and Carvin TS100) without blowing them up.
Hey Harley Hexxe,
Thank you. Of course you are right - they are 16ohm!
I am aware of sensitivity vs impedance. One of the reasons I don't really worry too much about blowing the G12H30's is that they are fairly efficient (100 db sensitivity) - noticeably louder than some of my other speakers. Whilst I have a newer Celestion G12H75 Creamback in my 18 watt combo, I pair that quite happily with the old Celestion G1230 in the extension cab. I have blasted away powering them via the 9100 for outdoor gigs (albeit in street venues) no probs - though I am aware that the old speaker is sharing its load equally as the Creamback has a similar impedance and sensitivity. For the increasingly rarer bigger gigs outdoors I do mic up - though I do ensure that onstage direct volume is always plenty for me without having to rely on monitors to hear myself.
Those 3116's are supposed to deliver 100 watts into a 4 ohm load but in reality that seems a bit optimistic - In general, I think that two speakers in stereo each driven at, say 15 watts, with 100 db sensitivity is probably good enough for most gigs.
Having said that, I have been using the 18 watt clone into a reactive load and then into the 9100 for outdoor gigs - but I have been using an EHX Magnum .44 to drive the speakers for indoor gigs and rehearsals.
That EHX pedal sized unit is a D class amplifier though it does have some amp like preamping going on within - it is surprisingly loud/powerful and has a convincing sound! I haven't done an indoor bar style gig yet where it wouldn't deliver (we have a fairly heavy handed drummer), I rarely mic up my gear. I am old fashioned and need my stuff to react with the guitar! I love to feel it too.
A small anecdote: I was in a band supporting Steve Marriott's Packet of Three for a gig in Oxford. We spent an afternoon trying to get everything balanced and I argued with the sound engineer - in the end my old AC30 was so quite I had to use an overdrive pedal and I could only hear myself through the monitors. Anyway, Steve Marriott turned up during the afternoon and said to the sound engineer "Just a couple of vocal mic's and some around the kit will be enough - the bass and my guitar will be plenty loud enough so no need to mic them". The sound engineer didn't argue.
It taught me that, so long as my volume is not drowning the band, I don't have to go through the P.A. There are some very good sound engineers who I do entrust with my sound - but there are many who I don't... :)
Quote from: rnolan on January 23, 2024, 01:46:00 AM
@Dante, that's a nice rig my friend :thumb-up: .
It is! Picture this; a 4-channel preamp....remind you of anything? Like an MP-1 Classic? It's only got one clean though and 3 dirts....one of them could be classified as a 'Brown' sound.
So, it's Tube Clean, Crunch, Lead, and ULTRA. The Ultra is pretty much MP-2 territory. It sounds great (of course) and it's PROGRAMMABLE. Yup, 128 patches. It has onboard effects that I don't use.
Quote from: rnolan on January 23, 2024, 01:46:00 AM
What died in your MP-2 way back when? My main MP-2 I bought new back in the early 90's has never missed a beat (it does get shitty when I run it on flaky generator power so I bought the 1.5KVA battery UPS for those moments). And it's still going strong (touch wood LoL)
Not entirely sure what made it 'die' on my, other than old age and lots of movement via gigging.
It was making more hum than tone. Now, it's just kinda noisy IIRC (been awhile since I plugged it in) but I seem to remember hearing all that noise in the background while I'm playing. The Gate tames it, but yeah, probably needs some new parts still
Hey vmaxvmax,
I believe that was Richard who commented on the speaker impedance ;)
But it sounds like you're good to go.
That's an amusing little anecdote with Steve Marriot, but I do agree, having your amps leveled out with the stage volume and blending in with everyone is always a good time. Unfortunately, most guitar players turn their amps up way too loud, and I've been guilty of that in the past too, and that just makes a mess of the whole thing.
Between my ADA gear and my Fender gear, I could bury just about anyone on the stage volume. I just don't like to do that. Maybe I'm getting old :lol:
Hey Richard,
I understand you want to keep the gear down, but there's really no way around stereo without two cabs. No matter what you do with a single 2x12 cab, you just can't get the width or stereo image out of one cab. The only way to do that is to send each channel through the PA and trust the sound man knows what to do.
With what you are wanting to do, the 2x12 cab would just be a personal guitar amp monitor cab for you and the rest would have to go through the mixing desk.
Hey Dante,
The "Brown" is one of the voices of the Classic, and I think the voice LEDs will show both the clean and distortion tube voices active to produce it.
Ultra? Did you find a way to modify your Classic? :???:
Well we are getting a bit off topic (MP-1 value). Maybe I should split this off before Kim does it for us LoL... Not to worry.
@ Dante, my MP-2 has been down many a dirt track in the back of a ute (I think you US guys call them pick ups?) and it's still fine, seriously, after all these years it's still going strong and sounding awesome, all I've done is changed tubes. I just finished a rehearsal with it, it's just purring away like always and sounding fantastic... Although I hear you, hence I bought a couple more MP-2s just in case. I have 2 in my studio rig, one with noise mod and screen replacement, the other was US model but I swapped tranies (so is now 240v) with another spare which has some slight issues (ribbon cable) and gave that one to MikeB.
@ Harley, yeah down sizing is where I'm at (like you guys). I used to use this 2 x 12" cab in stereo with my MP-1 rig for smaller gigs or mic'd up for larger gigs (or I'd use a quad box running stereo). Hey it's easier to put in the boot than my 2 x ADA slant split stacks or 2 x Messa P112s (my other choices). And yes 2 cabs with some space between them does sound better :thumb-up: . However, since I'm also the sound engineer for the band (you get the picture). Since I use a MP-2 I can also send the cab emulated outs to the FOH (if I need to), which I control...
@vmaxvmax, I'm perplexed by how may guitarists have negative experiences with sound guys. It seems there are quite a few (sound guys) who just don't get it :crazy: but then they (particularly the younger ones) don't seem to understand subs :facepalm: and crossover points either (they cross them over way to high and make the bass guitar a mush). One band I used to mix (live) for allot, I got them (the 2 guitar players) to run their Peavey Bandits like monitors angling back at them, so they could hear themselves fine, and they didn't affect the FOH mix. As a guitarist I understand, that you need to hear yourself at the right vol on stage (so you relax and play better), I miked them up so they also sounded good in the FOH, so everyone happy. It isn't that hard (well to me anyway)...
I am officially off topic
Quote from: Harley Hexxe on January 23, 2024, 02:52:04 PM
Hey Dante,
The "Brown" is one of the voices of the Classic, and I think the voice LEDs will show both the clean and distortion tube voices active to produce it.
Ultra? Did you find a way to modify your Classic? :???:
No, I was just saying the head I use has 4 channels (like a Classic) and one sounds like the Classic's Brown sound.
the channels (aka voicings)
Clean
Crunch
Lead
Ultra
Clean = Tube clean, definitely not an ADA solid state clean
Crunch = Brown soundish (nails it with a bit of the boost button)
Lead = Big rock distortion, bordering on Metal
Ultra = MP2 territory, very big, fat.....great for scooped mids and the devil's tuning (drop D)
So, in essence, I've found my Classic in a small tube head format. Whatever the format, I just want something reliable, which I have now...because it's only 8-10 years old. Wait 20 more, let's see where I am then ;)
Okay, back on topic;
I'm looking at stock MP-1s, unmodified, going for a minimum of $700 USD, to as much as $1100. The minimum was right around what they cost when they were new. In a few more years, I'd hate to see what the prices would get to. That's absurd for something with all that mileage :crazy:
Hey Richard,
I'm only downsizing for certain places that don't let me use an actual amp. For places that do, I still drag out my Fender Cyber-rig, and that's three combos. The plus about those is I can still plug direct to the mixing desk and trim the volume on stage down as low as I want, and I still get to hear my rig in W/D/W. If I just want a stereo rig, I can use a small 6RU head and a pair of Split-Stacks and that works too. I'm just not going to haul the 22RU effects rack, power amp rack, and all the Split-Stacks to a gig unless they pay me enough. ;)
Hey Harley, MP-1 prices have been climbing for a while now, go figure :dunno: :crazy: .
I used to use this 2 x 12 cab I'm rejuvenating for small gigs back in the day. At some point I'll build a small combo with 2 x 10", a MP-2, MultiFx and 1 RU power amp. Mean time, it will work reasonably well with my cut back 4 RU MP-2 rig and can be micked, and/or DI from the MP-2 cab sim outs for medium sized gigs.