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Author Topic: The Missing Element  (Read 700 times)

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Harley Hexxe

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The Missing Element
« on: Time Format »

Yesterday, I was playing through my MP-1 Classic and MP-2 rigs, and just digging the tones I was getting, and I checked into the presets I was using.
   I realized that one of the things that made my guitar sound so good was the fact that the Chorus was active in many of these presets. This got me thinking about the APP-1 and MP-1 channel. They didn't add the Chorus to either one, and they don't offer an external Chorus pedal either.
   IMHO, the ADA chorus was one of the best I've heard, and I had already been using it for a long time before the original MP-1 ever appeared on the market.
   I believe they should include this effect in the APP-1 and/or the MP-1 Channel. It would give the MP-1 Channel a bit more authenticity to the original MP-1.

    Just my 2 cents.
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Dante

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #1 on: Time Format »

You may be onto something Harley.

I use my chorus on my modern rock patch almost always. It does widen out the tone - make it sound bigger, fuller - than without it.
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Harley Hexxe

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #2 on: Time Format »

Dante,

    There seems to be a lot of patches in the MP-1 Classic, that have the Chorus in, and set in different ways. I noticed this when I was playing the VG Strat through it and looking for a dry clean tube sound for the Acoustic guitars. I had to create a clean patch for that application. I just never noticed it before now because with a regular guitar, they all sound pretty good.
    It's not that is sounds bad with the modeled guitar, but any and all effects you might want to use with it have to be used very sparingly, after all, in one of my posts about that guitar, I did point out the the Tone knob becomes an Ambient Reverb level,(Acoustic models only).
    That would be the only thing I would consider a downside to that. I have to roll off the tone knob to get a straight acoustic guitar sound, but sometimes, I forget to roll it back up before I switch to Electric guitar again.
    I just don't find reverb sounding very good before a modulation effect.
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rnolan

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #3 on: Time Format »

Hey Harley, salient point my friend, the ADA chorus in MP-1/2 Classic is also where the pseudo stereo starts and the APP-1/MP-1 Ch are both mono (not to say they wouldn't be enhanced by some decent bucket brigade analogue chorus). I had cause to read a bit of the MP-1 manual the other day, they refer to the chorus as a chorus or doubler (which, unless I specifically wanted chorus, I used as a doubler particularly with the MP-1 (rate 0 depth 100)).  But this works in a stereo setup (hmm never tried it in mono, I've been stereo with ADA from the get go..).  Though with the MP-2 (you tell me re classic pls) it's (rate 0 depth 100) more flangy as the chorus circuit is a little different (IIRC MJMP advised in a much ago post).  However, the clean sound I get from my MP-2 is to die for (and it's got chorus on it (and a fair amount of compressor)).
I suspect to get the MP-1 CH to sound more authentic, it needs to go stereo and include the great chorus, then to use it appropriately in the APP-1 loop, the loop would need to be stereo/parallel, Mmm this sounds like an MP-2.., LoL

Edit, just read you last post, IMHO, reverb should always be last (unless you have a good reason, say specific snare reverb)
« Last Edit: Time Format by rnolan »
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Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s

Harley Hexxe

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #4 on: Time Format »

I agree Richard,

    Reverb is always the last thing in my effects chain, if I use it. I don't have a choice with this guitar though, so it's going through the front end of the amp, but that's not a big deal. I prefer not to have any effect on acoustic guitars anyway.

     Still, it was just I small detail that I really didn't pay any attention to until now, and that got me thinking about the APP-1 and MP-1 Channel. That's when I realized this element of the quintessential ADA sound was missing from the new ADA offerings. I'm hoping the folks at ADA are still checking into the Depot every now and then and seeing this.

     It also tells me something else too. If I do get into the APP-1/MP-1 Channel set up that I have been curious about, and posted about in earlier discussions about these, then one thing I'm definitely going to do is add either a S-1000 or Digitizer 4 to the effects loop with the MP-1 Channel. It definitely needs to have that Chorus in there.

     All of a sudden, that fly rig just grew by 1RU  :lol: (Okay, so I'm nuts).

Edit: I just realized I didn't respond to your statement of the Chorus being different from the MP-2, it is. With Rate 0, and Depth 100, there is a definite stereo shift (as I call it). It's almost imperceptible to the ear, and you really have to listen to pick it up, but there is a very slow motion to the stereo image. I wouldn't call it flangey as you can't hear the sweep in a clean sound.
« Last Edit: Time Format by Harley Hexxe »
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rnolan

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #5 on: Time Format »

Hey Harley, as you know I'm also quite attracted to the App-1/MP-1 ch idea, and small light easy is on  my mind, as I mull it over, it becomes what am I prepared to give up  :dunno: , is not maybe a MP-2 or MP-1 Classic/MultiFx in a 2 RU (as Dante has put together) a better option (but looming in ones mind.. the App-1/MP-1ch are (brand) new, and hey, I'm happy to support ADA, they helped make my whole guitar world awesome). You could also run the APP-1 and MP-1ch (either/and/plus/or) into a small desk, add Fx and really fill your glass... But then we get complicated again, well not so much for us, we like complicated  :facepalm: .
I recently got my Marshall 50 "serviced" and I got the tech to make one input jack direct to poweramp (well to the phase splitter tube) as MJMP does it (unfortunately I only have one Marshall  :'( ). Now this is where I'd plug in the APP-1 (if I had one) and I'd definitely want the MP-1ch in the loop but I'd want to add delay and Reverb to that, I recon this would sound really good, but not quite as good as my stereo rig.
With the MP-2 chorus at 0/100, it's much more noticeable (and flangey) with my stereo wired split stack (which I use allot  :facepalm: one cab mmm), with 2 separate cabs it's not so perceptible. Lately I've been playing through the Mesa P112s (12 + Horn, great cabs BTW  :thumb-up: ) and combining the MP-2 cab sim outs and main outs (via mixer + Fx) > B200s > P112s.  Running these rigs in stereo with good gear just sounds "shit" hot, hence my slight trepidation to go to a mono setup..
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Studio Rig: MP2/MB1 > Eurorack UB2442FX-Pro > TC M-One XL > Behringer Truths (with Truth Sub) / QUAD ESL 63s
Live Rig: MP2/MB1 > Alesis Quadverb > Alesis Midiverb 4 > Yamaha AM802 > B200s/Carvin TS100/DCM200L > ADA Split Stacks/Mesa P112s

Harley Hexxe

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #6 on: Time Format »

Richard,

    It's only mono until I add the Digitizer 4 in the loop. That would give me the ADA chorus I like after the MP-1 Channel in the loop, with the additional output now for the 2nd audio channel. Run all of that into a MicrocabII, and into a desk...

    Oops! the fly rig just grew another rack space  :lol:
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Dante

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #7 on: Time Format »

Your fly rig is bigger than my gig rig (that's what she said)
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Harley Hexxe

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #8 on: Time Format »

Pretty fly for a white guy :lol:
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MarshallJMP

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #9 on: Time Format »

So Harley do you like your digitizer?
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Harley Hexxe

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Re: The Missing Element
« Reply #10 on: Time Format »

So Harley do you like your digitizer?
   I've had Digitizer's for many years, and they come in handy when you only have one rack space to play with, and you need a few different effects. They also work very well with S-1000's in tandem, through the effects loop of a stereo preamp.
   Up until you pointed out the stereo separation it's capable of, I just used it as I would have a S-1000, just with a few more options. I haven't really tried it in the Classic or the MP-2 with the stereo split.
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