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Other ADA Gear => Combo Amps => Topic started by: Dante on January 12, 2018, 10:34:43 AM

Title: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 12, 2018, 10:34:43 AM
Kim already knows about this, but I just landed a VIPER on Reverb and it looks REALLY clean. Can't wait till I git 'er
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: rnolan on January 12, 2018, 11:19:55 AM
 :whoohoo!: :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Kim on January 12, 2018, 04:04:09 PM
I can't believe that Viper came up for sale in such good condition.  Pretty sure they are more rare than the QuadTube, but less rare than the other Sidewinder series amps.  These Vipers are so much better than what you'd normally think a 1x12 combo would be.  They sound AMAZING.  The Crunch on the Green channel was worth it alone, plus it has more tonal selections over in the Red channel.  The VariCab makes it behave like a much bigger amp and cab; engaging it makes the sound just leap out at you.

Damn fine score, Dante. Damn fine score.   :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 12, 2018, 08:31:25 PM
Thanks man, I appreciate you getting back to me so fast too  :thumb-up:

Now, I have opened a whole can of worms here because I need some sort of delay/chorus/multi effects pedal to pair with this thingy. Of course, I just sold my Boss GT-8 about two months ago  :face palm: that woulda been fine. I have a Morley volume/wah ready for use, just need some sort of multi effect with delay/chorus/flange/modulation/tremolo etc. It doesn't need to be a good source of gain or distortion. I'm watching tons of videos of demos right now trying to get an idea of what I want to use.

For now, I can use my Tech 21 Fly rig. By itself, it's great to get you through a gig....as a multi effects, it's limiting. Only a delay or chorus, not both. There is reverb and an amp sim, then there's the OMG distortion I could (but probably won't much) add to the viper. There are a slew of copycats out there that offer a delay and a chorus in a tiny package....just looking around now.

I may revisit the iPad, and a bluetooth controller. The iPad could sit either on my amp or on my pedal board...probably my board, where I could see what I'm using on each patch.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 13, 2018, 02:43:51 AM
Dante, we will be expecting a full review with soundclips  ;D
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 13, 2018, 12:53:01 PM
hi Dante,
Couple month ago i got an ada viper too (70 bucks :metal:), amazing how those units looks good even after 25 years !
actually i'm using it with a boss ME-x pedalboard, you got all the delay/flanger/chorus/EQ...  whatever modulations.

but you also got 3 free spaces for your stomps too.

it works pretty well for me, you should check

tomy

Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 13, 2018, 01:14:31 PM
$70!?!?  You sir, are a THIEF. That's a steal. Nice score  :thumb-up:

Thanks Tomy, I did seriously consider that. They sound great for f/x and are rock solid for gigging. However, I'm going to explore using my iPad mini first to create a high-tech option that could also be run directly into the board. It'll save me some floorspace too. If that doesn't work, or if it turns out to be too much of a pain to use at a show, I'll go with the simple ME-x unit. Very reliable stuff and programmable. That works.

I bought one of these foot pedals (https://griffintechnology.com/intl/stompbox-gc29031) for my iPad. Cost under $15 with shipping
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 16, 2018, 08:49:35 PM
BUMP. Gonna try the iPod Touch with the 4 button USB switch that is on it's way. ALSO gonna try the TC Electronic Nova System I just picked up  :thumb-up:

I used one of these with my Boogie combo & it was quite nice. I have been getting reacquainted with the manual tonight and now remember why I liked it so much. The spillover delays are great, the simply access of presets and the easy way to turn individual FX on/off in a patch are all great features. The effects are also TOP NOTCH, which is nice ;)

I have an old pedal board that I made from plywood and a suitcase out of a thrift shop. I'm gonna repurpose that for this rig. I can fit the wah on the board, but not while playing, I just store it on the board for travel then take it off and have it next to my other pedals. I'll post a pic of the board when i have it all together. Pretty simple setup though, just a switch for the amp, the Nova system for FX, and a wah.

The Nova is like having (up to) 7 stompboxes per preset, it's pretty cool. One thing i forgot - the buttons change settings on RELEASE, not when you push them. It's actually quite handy that way...you hold the button until the magic moment and release it for instant tone change.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 17, 2018, 05:28:06 PM
IT'S HEEEERE!!!

The Viper arrived at work today and I couldn't wait for quitting time to get home and try her out. Within minutes of arriving at home, i had a beer popped and the Viper plugged in  :thumb-up:

First impressions: Love the clean. Love the Lead. Love the Crunch...wait, I can get that crunch using the Brown - awesome! Very versatile, sounds big and boomy like my ol' Mesa Boogie DC-5 in the Grind with the emulation on, but I don't have to fiddle with the knobs to get a good sound. It sounds good FLAT LINED on the EQ. Love that. The boost is crazy loud, the Lead channel has more gain than a 3tm (I have no way of confirming this), and it's WAY lighter than my ol' Boogie. Basically, I got my Boogie back, with a MUCH easier EQ to dial in.

Love. It. Already.

I will be noodling all night with this thing, and I'll record a sound clip for y'all.

Update:
Hooked up the Nova System, and it sounds amazing. I'm really only using the Reverb and the Grind voicing. Clean is also very nice, almost as warm as the MP-2, warmer than the MP-1 Classic for sure...probably warmer than the stock MP-1 too. Not sure what's going on in there, but yeah, it is a nice clean. Not crazy about the reverb, so I'm using my Nova for that.

Ideally, I'd like a footswitch that could access all the voicings, I don't care about the boost, I have that in the Nova System.

These are the options:

Green Channel
Clean (very clean, very warm)
Crunch (gets great overdrive, goes all the way to hot rodded plexi)

Red Channel
Vintage (more to come)
Brown (more to come, but I can easily capture the Crunch tone with this voicing)
Grind  (HOT Marshall sound - speaker emulation can get you to Boogie realm)
Lead (from MP-1 to 3TM)

That would be a 6 button switch, but i could totally get along with a 5-button and just use the Clean Green and all the RED voicings. That's the ideal foot switch. Here are my settings (right now):

Green
Drive = 5
Bass = 3
Mid = 5.5
Treb = 6
Master = 4

Red (Grind)
Drive = 7
Bass = 5
Mid = 3
Treb = 6
Master = 2

No boost, no Reverb (Nova system does this)

Gate = 7.5
Presence = 6.5

Varicab = 2x10 / Dark
Thump = 5
Hi-Cut = 8
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 01:21:32 AM
Hi Dante,

You're like a child in front of his christmas pack  :banana-trip:

I sold my others combos since I got this one (definitely like clean chanel)

here is my setting too, let's compare


$70!?!?  You sir, are a THIEF. That's a steal. Nice score  :thumb-up:

I'm no thief, just paid the price asked and get lucky that time. the seller told me : "you're the 20th guys calling today for this amp but you're the only one saying "hello... please... thank you..." so I'm gonna sell it to you, man !" that is what is all about !

Amazing how words can produce some magic, isn't it ?

Tomy
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 18, 2018, 04:42:41 AM
The original switch has only 4 switches according to the schematics and pic's I found on the net. It has green, green boost, red and red boost.
I attached the schematic of the switch. You could make one quite easily just with 4 buttons, 4 resistors and a stereo input jack.(R219-R222, Sw12-15,J7)
Downside is you don't have the LED feedback. For this you will have to make the whole schematic.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 18, 2018, 07:27:25 AM
Thanks MJMP, I have that schematic and intend on building that switch. I'm also noodling around in my brain that there should be a way to craft a switch to access the other voicings in the Red channel....much later on, after I do some research. It seems like it's possible, given that they are just switches inside the amp, I just need to activate them outside the amp, so I'd probably rig up a midi cable to run the switches and hardwire a plug in the amp.  :dunno:  I don't know if that's even possible, but what if?

Tomy: My Green channel is a bit brighter, but our Red channels are very close. Can't quite make out which voicing you're using (them buttons are hard to see :) )

BTW: Manners will get you very far. Thank you  :waving-banana-smiley-emoticon:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 10:36:25 AM
snake charmer
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 10:38:16 AM
aaahhh ! first time I open it, I'd never expect it to be so technical

I thought it was a simple switch
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 11:06:29 AM
... A/DA doesn't mean easy (for me !)
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 11:07:50 AM
you ask the voicings... you get the voicings
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 18, 2018, 11:08:52 AM
so the emul !

thank you MJ for schematics :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 18, 2018, 05:31:57 PM
so the voicings are Clean and Lead - I concur, that pair works great. I can also get by with the Grind

The emulation on mine is 2x10 Dark (wait ten minutes, it'll probably change )
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Kim on January 18, 2018, 05:38:24 PM
aaahhh ! first time I open it, I'd never expect it to be so technical

I thought it was a simple switch

I have pics of the footswitch here: 
http://adadepot.com/index.php?topic=1632.msg21241#msg21241 (http://adadepot.com/index.php?topic=1632.msg21241#msg21241)
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 18, 2018, 07:32:15 PM
Um...I have the schematics in front of me, and I admit, I have no idea how to read them, but....are there Eproms on this thing? I see them in your pix  :???:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 18, 2018, 09:12:39 PM
If my thinking is correct ( and that would be a big surprise right there ) Couldn't you access pretty much ANY switch inside the amp if you hard wired it to some sort of jack and then connect a cord to a foot switch?

If so, you could us a mic cable (XLR), a midi cable, or just about any cannon plug full of wires. Of course, this involves modifying your amp with a jack/plug/hole in the chassis. So, there's that to think about. But, it would be cool to have a little 4x4 footswitch to control 4 voices on the amp and another one to select your favorite 4 cab sims. Just be a couple pedals on the board, would do so much for versatility during a gig. You may be able to get this done with one Midi cable and a 6 or 8 button pedal....or a couple TRS cables and stereo plugs....or a couple XLR (mic) cables.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Systematic Chaos on January 18, 2018, 09:33:07 PM
Half-correct bro. The channel switching can be done both manually and via the foot switch since there's a relais (triggered by an electrical impulse) in the circuit (inside the amp). I doubt that there are relais in there for the voicing and cab sim switches.
MJMP sure can shed some insight on that
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on January 18, 2018, 11:04:49 PM
Ah...Relays, impulses...totally makes sense. So, I'll buy a box of impulses, relay them into the back of the amp, and Voila! Magic ensues.

I knew I was making that too easy. Thanks man
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on January 19, 2018, 12:24:22 AM
hi Dante, you 're right about the emul ; you'll change setting every ten minutes until you feel good with one setting, and you'll change later... and so !

Awesome pics Kim ; this switch is pretty well built but you have to desolder all buttons to watch inside
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 20, 2018, 08:00:43 AM
Quick question, for the channel and boost switching on the amp, are these momentary switches or do they latch?
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 20, 2018, 08:04:14 AM
Half-correct bro. The channel switching can be done both manually and via the foot switch since there's a relais (triggered by an electrical impulse) in the circuit (inside the amp). I doubt that there are relais in there for the voicing and cab sim switches.
MJMP sure can shed some insight on that

There are no relays inside, the channel and boost switching is all done in an electronic way. For the other ones it's just a switch that switches stuff in and out.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Kim on January 21, 2018, 07:45:49 AM
Quick question, for the channel and boost switching on the amp, are these momentary switches or do they latch?

The Channel Selectand Boost buttons are momentary.  The Voicing buttons are latching.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: MarshallJMP on January 22, 2018, 05:25:47 AM
Thanks Kim  :thumb-up:
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on February 03, 2018, 08:19:07 PM
UPDATE: I've been using the Viper for practice and getting reacquainted with the Nova System. I have 3 presets available at a time, each one is basically a pedalboard of effects. So, I have 3 pedalboards per bank. I have decided to set them up similar to my rack rigs...with three basic EQ settings; Classic rock (flat, possibly with a bit of midrange honk), Modern (more bottom, less mids), and METAL (super scooped mids, big bottom).

Like my rack rig, I will use a bank per guitar. I set one bank up already and the Nova System's EQ makes a huge difference. It's a 3-band parametric EQ and I'm using the freqs from my MP-2's graphic EQ. You choose a frequency, boost or cut it, and then set the width. Pretty simple and very reactive.

This amp hits you like a punch in the mouth....in a good way. THANK YOU SIR, MAY I HAVE ANOTHER! Sounds way bigger than it is, without all the weight.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on February 04, 2018, 01:42:04 AM
... and you can still add an extra cab !

have you tried the ipod pedal ? I'm curious about efficiency

Tomy
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on February 04, 2018, 08:13:47 AM
Tomy - YES. I have hooked up my 1x12 Thiele cab and my 4x12 H&K cab to this little beast already. The thing about external speakers is, they don't get the Vericab voicing at all, just clean signal (to use the sound of the actual speaker cab). My Thiele was a bit bright (big magnet on that EV speaker), and my H&K 4x12 was pretty transparent, but not as loud as the Viper because the sound was distributed to four speakers instead of one.

I think I prefer the 4x12 cab.... I'm going to try using that without the Viper's internal speaker running.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on February 10, 2018, 02:59:18 PM
BUMP: I took the Viper chassis out today to inspect the innards after I noticed the input jack is pretty floppy. I tightened the jack nut, but all that did was make it harder to put the plug in...still a bit wobbly when fully inserted. Pretty ingenious design really, the amp chassis just sits on a shelf in the back of the speaker cab. I shoulda taken pix, that would help you understand what I mean.

Anyway, as i suspected, the jacks are those 'boxed-in' kind that attach directly to a pcb. Awesome...nothing's easy sometimes.

So...while inside, I wanted to see what kind of tubes were in there, because they sound AMAZING. I don't want to change them, because they sound that good. First, they are not easy to change. You have to remove the little tiny reverb tank just to reach inside, and it's still not easy. I flashed my light in there, to get a good look at the print on the tubes - one is encased in a shield with a ground wire attached, so I'm trying to read the other one. It's got green writing, kinda Old English looking font...can't make it out....the writing is on the far side of the tube.

I end up taking the tube out, and I can honestly say that I don't have any of these tubes in any other amps, nor have I ever. The green print says: Baldwin Pianos and Organs

I take the ground shield off the other one and pull it out; yup, another Baldwin. Apparently, these organ tubes sound great in a Viper. I think Kim landed a box full of Baldwin tubes a while back.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Kim on February 10, 2018, 04:08:51 PM
Yeah that chassis design is a bit weird when you're used to seeing the normal rack preamp boards.  But it all seems to fit together and make sense somehow.

Baldwin tubes, huh.  Never heard of those.  Obviously rebranded; can you see if there is any of the original printing under that?  I had a bunch of Wurlitzer tubes that sounded great and were actually rebranded RCA tubes (made in USA circa 1960-63).   Remember there's very few actual tube factories in the world still in production.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on February 10, 2018, 07:47:58 PM
WURLITZER. That's what it was. I knew you had some organ tubes....like a box full.

I would imagine that these organ companies would want quiet tubes, not high gains. If so, I might be trying some Tung Sols and possibly a GE. I know that this amp uses one tube for the 'clean' or GREEN channel and both tubes for the 'gain' or RED channel....like a gain stack. Gotta figure out which tube does what, I may be in the market for a tube cocktail. Like a Tung Sol for the cleans and a JJ or something for the stack.

For now though, I ain't fixin' what ain't broke. It sounds killer.
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Kim on February 11, 2018, 05:19:54 AM
The Viper just isn't nearly as easy to do some tube-rollin' with as a rack unit. 

If anyone was to do some modding to the Viper (very debatable, as some would consider it a violation of a rare amp) I'd definitely suggest moving the tubes to the outside of the chassis to make it easy to swap tubes.  Hey I have a great idea how to accomplish that mod without defacing or devaluing the amp.....   >:D
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: Dante on February 11, 2018, 07:50:08 AM
Uh, I think I'll pass on that 'mod' and leave the tubes inside.  :nono:

Funny thing; the manual actually recommends replacing them every two years
Title: Re: NGD: Super Clean VIPER!!
Post by: tomy on February 11, 2018, 09:08:38 AM
Hi Dante,
I'll check what tubes are inside my viper next week when i'll Come back home. I think previous owner never change it before as they still sound great, I also remember they are pretty hard to change.

Hey Kim, I' d be OK to test your mod on my viper !
Let me know

Cheers
Tomy